US Hawks Hang Gliding Association

Bob wrote:The timid "members" of Jack's little kingdom cower in silence...

Rick wrote:Is this really what hang gliding has been reduced to?

Not completely ... but mostly.  

It's helpful to read the following topic from start to finish, and ask yourself why so many supposedly "good" men watched Joe Faust be banned and why so many are allowing that injustice to go unnoticed and unpunished to this very day:

    http://forum.hanggliding.org/viewtopic.php?t=36135
    (Note that Jack changed every "USHGRS" to "involuntarylist")

Joe broke no rules. Joe was polite. Joe didn't even take Jack's bait. But bully Jack banned Joe anyway in front of the whole school yard of frightened onlookers cowering in silence. That's the way bullies operate. They make an example of someone to keep the other sheeple in line.

But here's the really nasty and insidious part. Every one of those cowardly onlookers know that they should have spoken up. They know it deep down in their souls. They will make all kinds of excuses about why they silently watched an injustice (I've heard them all), but in their hearts they will still know that they chickened out. That's their own personal shame that's so painful to them that they do the unthinkable - blame the victim. They need to convince themselves somehow that Joe "deserved it" so they can clear their own consciences for having watched in silence. That's the most insidious part of this kind of bullying because it abuses the victim twice. The fear that Jack Axoupolous has created turns otherwise good men into co-abusers. This effect was very well documented in the Stanford Prison Experiment, and it's painful to see it played out in real life.

Every "member" of hanggliding.org who continues to post on that site without calling for Joe's reinstatement - on every post - is rubbing salt into the wounds of this injustice.

Sure. Joe also got banned by the morons on PGForum for trying to discuss the PDMC.
Here on the US Hawks, we hold Joe in high esteem as an obvious foundational figure in the rebirth of hang gliding.
Still, I see continued attempts to reason with deluded people on the nanny doppelganger forums.
Do you know why they say you shouldn't wrestle with a pig?
It's because you get muddy and disgusted but the pig likes it. You are wasting your time.
I tend to think that the cream rises to the top, turds sink and everyone gets to choose their own level.
Why get in the way of that? Don't chum the swamp.
Let the US Hawks be the beacon.

I mean, look at the sport. Today's hang glider pilots have willingly let their association be taken over by parachutists.
That was very stupid. Do we want them here? I think not. Stupid is not the way to go.
In one of the most shameful events in our history, the USHGA tossed negative loading and countless lives out the window for greater membership dollars.
Many USHPA pilots support this kind of thinking. Do we want them here? Heavens, no! Let them stay there. They belong there.
The USHPA is killing the sport of hang gliding by eliminating peer training, creating insurance monopolies and filling our sites with skynets.
Many USHPA pilots support these destructive policies when they should be rebelling.
What could they possibly contribute? Leave them alone. Leave them in our dust.
There is no real representation for hang gliding anymore and yet most pilots go to the nanny doppelganger sites and pretend there is.
I say let them stay there. Let them stew in their own sour juice.
Why would we want to drag them over here if they have nothing to offer?
We certainly don't need them. They know we are here. They visit. They know what's going on. Yet they choose the road to ruination.
I say, let them. They are of no use to us. Let them support paragliding with more than half their dues in their weird hybrid association.
The strength in numbers argument no longer applies in the face of the revised recreational liability laws.
Flying hang gliders is free. Flying hang gliders is a right. All we need is a core of devoted hang glider pilots to start over.
We don't need people who don't get it. The ones who come of their own volition are the ones we need. They are the cream.
We do need Joe Faust and the USHGRS, though.
Thanks, Joe. From a tiny acorn, a mighty oak will grow.        

I've been fuming all day about Jack's insulting me, calling me a shill for banned people. I'd like to tell him how i feel about that but I haven't figured out how to PM him.

I even followed his rule about not mentioning US Hawks and USHGRS instead telling pilots to search to find the unmentionable sites. Even posted again with several remarks removed. Ended in the basement and locked, so that no one can even comment there in the basement. I don't know what size Jack is so i can't call him a little coward, a medium size coward, or a big coward for not wanting to see any potential positive replies to the posting. What exactly is he so afraid of?

I was at my shop (working off my anger) installing the curved spreader bar I made for my seat harness and also working with another way to build the adapter bars that would free me from dependence on a tube bending shop to do it right. At one point I walked into the room where the Basic trainer scale model sits. All of this got me to thinking about how much "pablum" exists on HG.org. I don't see much from the innovators of gliders and hardware. Yes, Sunny Jim but rarely and there was the guy with the combo seat / prone harness. I have never seen a post from Mike Meier or Steve Pearson. Maybe Mike posted something about the WW Easy Flyer but I didn't see it if he did. Other systems type innovators like Joe Faust and Bob Kuczewski get kicked off.

He says the forum is growing and getting more posts. That is because people don't know how much is being hidden from them. How much good stuff is removed. We don't actually know how many spoke up on Joe's behalf, because we would never see it. He wants us to think nobody did. He says all the PM's he got were in favor of Joe's banning. I don't believe that at all. He can say anything but nobody can check it. At least when the president lies there are plenty of fact checkers around to say: " this is what he said and this is why it isn't true". We don't have that capability with Jack's statements. It's: "believe me or go away".

Frank, the shill, Colver

Jack often claims that everyone supports him and that his forum is growing. More lies.

I'm sure many of us remember a time when there were so many posts every hour on hanggliding.org that it was hard to keep up. Now there are just a few posts a day on only a few active topics. I do think there are more active pilots on hanggliding.org than on US Hawks, but not by nearly as many as there were when we started.

There are probably a number of reasons for the decline of hanggliding.org. A lot more people are using Facebook and Twitter for communication. The local club forums have gotten better. But I also think more people are seeing how abusive Jack has become with changing posts and locking topics. And of course, he's banned some of the most active hang gliding posters on the planet.

As I said earlier, I'm glad you got to see it first hand Frank. When someone complains about being kicked out of something, it's natural to suspect they may have deserved it. It's hard to convince people otherwise unless they see it first hand. So I have to be thankful that Jack has shown his true colors in these recent episodes.

Jack's site is another reason that USHPA has gone so far astray. The free press was factored into our constitution to keep the government honest. With corruption in both USHPA and "The web's #1 hanggliding website" where are the checks and balances? There have been none and USHPA's lost insurance has been one of many consequences.

We may not be as big as hanggliding.org or USHPA in numbers (yet), but the quality of our people is light years ahead.   
 
 
P.S. If you click on our "Members" button, it will default to listing by sign-up date. But you can sort by each of those columns (either up or down) by clicking on the column names. Each click on the column heading reverses the sorting order. Try sorting by number of posts with highest first. It's not surprising that I'm at the top, and a lot of my posts are either administrative or welcoming new members. But look at how many other people are in the multiple 1,000s or nearing 1,000 posts. And look at how many people are over 100 posts. It's really quite a group and we might be reaching a threshold to really start making things happen.

Frank Colver wrote:I've been fuming all day about Jack's insulting me, calling me a shill for banned people. I'd like to tell him how i feel about that but I haven't figured out how to PM him.

Did Jack insult you in a private message or in public? Did Jack bury your topic in a private message or in public? Did Jack lock your topic in a private message or in public? Did Jack shut you up in a private message or in public?

Is there any rule anywhere in Jack's site that keeps you from mentioning Joe Faust or USHGRS or his unfair banning? Don't let Jack enforce made up rules that he isn't willing to put into writing. Make him change the "Bob and Scott" rule to the "Bob and Scott and Joe Faust and USHGRS and USHawks and Frank Colver" rule. Then people will see how ridiculous this has become.

Every "member" of hanggliding.org who continues to post on that site without calling for Joe's reinstatement - on every post - is rubbing salt into the wounds of this injustice.

He did it in his reply to my second posting on the subject. The Post and his reply calling me a shill for banned people is in the basement and locked.

FC

My questions were rhetorical. Everyone can see what Jack did. He slapped you down because he didn't want you to rally any support for Joe or USHGRS. He's got everyone bullied into silence. He's also got everyone turning on Joe to justify their own silence. Everyone who's afraid to speak up is quietly telling themselves that Joe must have deserved getting banned. That's the only way they can preserve their false dignity and justify their silence. It's a disgusting display of how weak people are under fear of social ostracism.

Eventually Jack either controls you or he bans you. You either find yourself justifying Jack's bullying or you find yourself an outcast from his little society.

The "Banned of Brothers" is a badge of honor belonging to those who've refused to be herded like castrated cattle.

Bob Kuczewski wrote:My questions were rhetorical. Everyone can see what Jack did.

They might see it if they were paying attention. Many aren't paying attention.
Some won't see it because of self centered blindness. Look the other way. We're doing fine wearing these self centered blinders.
Like a Blindrodie, for instance.

He slapped you down because he didn't want you to rally any support for Joe or USHGRS. He's got everyone bullied into silence. He's also got everyone turning on Joe to justify their own silence. Everyone who's afraid to speak up is quietly telling themselves that Joe must have deserved getting banned. That's the only way they can preserve their false dignity and justify their silence. It's a disgusting display of how weak people are under fear of social ostracism.

And, 'hey I'm doing fine. I got mine.'

Eventually Jack either controls you or he bans you. You either find yourself justifying Jack's bullying or you find yourself an outcast from his little society.

Or you turn into a co conspirator in the murder of ideas and movements of things that you can't conceive and therefore cant control.
Like a Doug Marley, for instance.

The "Banned of Brothers" is a badge of honor belonging to those who've refused to be herded like castrated cattle.

Castrated cattle would be steers. My experience with steers are they are the most likely to bust through the gates fighting for their freedom.
Think about that the next hundred hamburgers you scarf down. You are eating an animal that just wants to be free.
They were forced down that chute.
No volunteers there so don't conflate a noble steer with the sycophants that have their noses up Jack Axaopoulos a** like Blindrodie and Doug Marley.

That said, so what does it say about our complacency in returning fire on Jack's cowardly little censorship and lies?
What is the argument again? Don't make waves and you'll probably be ok.
Hows that working out?
How many people really know what a cowardly little criminal act Jack and accomplices are pulling off?

It sure ain't "everybody" is it?

That's why the crime has to be documented, preserved and published.
At least make a sticky much better than the Bob K. and Scott Wise sticky in Jack's black hole basement.
That sticky alone is a personal indictment against Jack's integrity.
What kind of a weak person does it take to write something like that thinking he has the high road?
A very weak person. One that needs to be exposed to the ones that haven't been paying attention.

Once everyone has been exposed to the truth and put on the spot to pick a side it will be the downfall of "the largest hang gliding community in the world".
Then it will make sense to walk away, if they have a place to go.

Not to say the castrated cow comments were entirely incorrect. You are on to a critical element in the go along to get along, I've got mine crowd mentality.
It's just more a mindless sheep thing with mass chemical/social indoctrination/emasculation that keeps the herd under control.

Chemicals in the water, food and air have castrated the survival instinct from us. Most can't acknowledge it even with proof in front of their face.
Gay frogs, Brian.
https://news.berkeley.edu/2010/03/01/frogs/
https://www.rawstory.com/2018/11/toxic- ... ing-water/
https://www.naturalnews.com/2018-11-15- ... evels.html
https://www.naturalnews.com/2018-11-14- ... ality.html
These aren't the last word on this. Just what crossed my view this morning. I can do better but need to get outside in 50* temps to do more ant work.

Free wrote:Not to say the castrated cow comments were entirely incorrect. You are on to a critical element in the go along to get along, I've got mine crowd mentality.

Thanks Warren. Your post got me re-reading this topic. I've written a lot of stuff, but I think this quote boils it all down to what people need to know when participating in Jack's forum:

Eventually Jack either controls you or he bans you. You either find yourself justifying Jack's bullying or you find yourself an outcast from his little society.