Here's my post from January 03, 2011 8:38 pm:
bobk wrote:FOR THE RECORD . . .
I have been checking the server logs and there is a good chance that all of these "people":
are all just one single person
with an obvious grudge against Sara and possibly Kayte. I have to give credit to Warren ("Free
") for being the first to spot all of these as likely aliases for one single person. Good Job Free!!!
So Sara and Kayte, please ignore this one person with a grudge, and please carry on with your good work.
I support both of you even more after seeing what you're up against with these filthy posts.
Here's my final post on that topic from January 12th, 2011 8:45 am :
bobk wrote:Good comments all around. Thanks to everyone.
Here's where I think we are in Lakeview ...
It's clear that some small-minded person just doesn't like Sara, and as a result, they don't like the Lakeview Hawks. "Boo hoo"
It's also clear that a hang gliding and/or paragliding club in the Lakeview area would be positive for both the sports and the local community.
So I suggest that we just leave the haters behind and focus on building a club that's positive and uplifting for the sports and its members. If we do that well, then it will stand on its own merits. That's the high road.
I should also say that I've been very very encouraged by the SW Texas Hang Gliders club in Leakey Texas. I believe their town is even smaller than Lakeview, and they don't have nearly as many foot-launch sites. But what they lack in size and sites, they more than make up for in their positive "can do" attitude. I've been to two of their meetings so far, and there's been lots of good discussions about how to promote the sport, work with the local community, and just become a positive force for hang gliding. Even if Leakey had no hang gliding at all, I'd be proud to be a member of their club and just hang out with those good people. That's what I think the Lakeview / Warner Mountain club should do.
Let's ignore this small band of haters and move forward by building a positive group that will make us all proud to be members.
And finally, here are my replies to each of your points Warren:
bobk wrote: Covering up a problem does not solve it.
Sweeping a problem under the rug doesn't make it go away.
Deleting those posts would have been covering it up and sweeping it under the carpet. That's why I didn't do it.
Erasing those posts would not have made the poster(s) go away.
You knew up front that it was one poster and that a crime was being committed.
First of all, I didn't know until you made the suggestion and I looked it up to find the same IP address used in all cases. Second, I still don't really "know" since it is possible that multiple people can get the same IP address on different dates, or even use the same computer to register (such as a public library computer). Third, I do know from talking to real people that there were multiple people who were not happy with Sara. Fourth, I do not - to this day - know that a crime was committed. Can you point out the exact portions of any posts that you feel were criminal? Can you cite the exact law that was broken?
Lakeview is a small town of less than 3000 people,
It's not immaterial. My point was that Sara was likely bumping into those people in real life. They were likely making her miserable in real life. Deleting those posts would not have made that go away. The real problem needed to be addressed by the good pilots in the Lakeview area standing behind Sara. I felt the best way to do that was to have a local pilot take over the club from Sara but still give her a position of respect in the club. That would eliminate the complaint that it was "Sara's club" and draw the focus from her. It would also give her a little "win" in her life which I believe was something she needed. When people are faced with "tipping points" (see my comments below), it helps them to have something positive in their life to focus on. I believe a positive club with positive and supporting members would have been just such a "life preserver" in her times of need.
and the evil that we saw on this forum was surely manifesting itself in other (more concrete) ways in Sara's life
More reason to take action against it.
I was taking action. I was contacting other pilots in the area (like Ralph and Derk and Roger) trying to enlist their support. I was trying to get them to step forward and support Sara's club in a public way. Sara had already gotten some newspaper coverage on the formation of her club. With more local support she could have built on that.
That was the sickness that needed to be addressed, and the ugly words were a call for people to step forward to support Sara in whatever way they could.
The ugly words were a crime being committed by one person. That person's digital fingerprints are all over this and it's in the 'record' to this day and forever.
The clock is ticking.
I am not enough of an expert on the law to know if those words were a crime. From my layman's opinion, I think they were not. But you're welcome to change my mind. Again, please quote the exact passages from the posts and the laws that you think were broken. Also, while I don't feel a crime was committed, if you feel differently, please report it. Give law enforcement my contact information, and I'll cooperate with IP addresses and any other information they require.
Some of you (Warren and others) offered posts of support from far away. Thank you.
No reason for you to thank me because I didn't do enough. I didn't change your mind and I let it go without educating you more to how serious cyber bullying can be. Especially for females, and exponentially more so for emotionally compromised people, to which you have alluded after the fact.
As I said above, from my layman's opinion, I didn't (and still don't) think a crime was committed. If you feel otherwise, then you should report it. As I said, I will cooperate with any requests from law enforcement.
But the people who could have done the most - the local pilots who fly Lakeview - didn't step up. That's the disappointment that I've expressed in this topic.
People don't commit suicide because pilots won't join their club.
You're right. There was certainly a lot more going on in Sara's life than hang gliding or a club. But I do believe that small things can be the "tipping points" for such decisions. Based on the timing of her decision (2013?), I suspect that the failure of the club was just one of many things leading up to that tipping point. We may never know what the "final straw" was in Sara's life, but I firmly believe that positive acceptance of Sara and her club would have been a "life-line" that might have helped her past each of the potential "final straw's" that she faced. As I mentioned earlier, I think that positive "wins" in a person's life can save their life when they're down. I believe that having a successful club would have been such a win, and would also have given her a circle of friends and activities that might very well have helped her through whatever other problems she was having.
Free wrote:What needs to be done to pinpoint/prove who made those posts?
I still have the dates and times, the IP addresses, and the email addresses used to register those accounts. I also have IP addresses and dates and times of the posts. If you want to report this as a crime, please give the police my contact information, and I will supply them with that information. They would be the experts on how to proceed. As I said, from my layman's understanding, I don't see a crime at this time, but I'll certainly cooperate with any authorities who want to pursue it.