[Bill Cummings]

Davis posted this over on the OZ Report Index

New post Not happy at Lookout Thu, Jun 11 2015, 4:52:40 pm
I received this today:

From: Doc Savage
Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2015 4:35 PM
To: <email>

Dear Davis. You were just recommended to me from a Friend, that you may wish to post this to the Oz Report. I'm too old and sick now to start signing up with new places, but this is what I just went through, and hopefully I'll get it out of my system soon, so I may enjoy what time I have left with AOD.


Hello Folks.

I just returned from Lookout Mountain Hang Gliding Flight Park, and must be honest with you. This being the 5th time I left home since 1969 turned out to be the worst 3 weeks and $2.000 Dollars, $1,400 of which went to lessons that were absolutely useless, along with the Owner of the Lookout Mountain Park, Matt Tabor. He turned out to be a lying Blasphemer, along with his 2 bit Stoolie, Shawn. What started out as a great experience upon arriving was a complete nightmare at the end.

I had the sad opportunity of meeting the owner Matt Tabor at their store on top of the Mountain. Apparently he thought I put $2,400 down on a glider which was a misinterpretation on his part. I had the girl who ran the store to put it in their safe so I didn't carry such a large amount with me.
While talking with him, he said to me that,(Ahhh, for another $1,500 we can put a set of heavy duty wheels on the Hang Glider for landing.) He said it as though it was 2 bits. When he said that, I told him forget it, I'm not able to afford that much more plus all the other equipment that goes along with owning a Hang Glider. That was my 1st week at that time when this all occurred. I had 15 Tandem Tickets, And 3 Solo Tickets. They make you buy the last 2 solo tickets needed to qualify.

What this Matt Tabor went and did to me as a Pastor and a 100% Disabled Veteran, is unconscionable. He told his instructors to back off on teaching me, so as to fail the course. "Yes", I was told this by instructors who told me that because of Matt they were told not to sign me off on what I accomplished. When I got down to my last 3 Aero Tow Tandem Tickets and 3 Solo Tickets , Owner, Matt Tabor, personally told my Instructor not to pass me for Solo. That being the case, I refused to waste the price of the tickets for nothing, and Matt Tabors Mole, Shawn, who is like a stoolie texts him everything that happens throughout the day, whether it be about an employee or student, good or bad.

Shawn took my tickets and told me he'd get me a refund of $200.00 for them. At noon the next day I approached Shawn, and he told me Matt refused to give a refund. By the time I got done Hollering at him,I had all but lost my voice, telling him what kind of Evil people you work for, and that same day because of getting so excited had to take 9 Nitro Glycerene Tabs, and when that mixed with my Isosorbide Nitrate,(Time released Nitro Glycerine) became quit sick for 2 hours dry heaving.

I was so infuriated that I almost disregarded taking my Venlefaxine, for Bi-Polar. But, there is no one worth going to prison for there, so God helped me to get through this dark time in my life that I thought were all days of the past. Finally, the Instructor that I first booked with was able to talk to this Matt Tabor, and procure my $200.00 rebate for the tickets I had turned in 2 days earlier at that point.

Since Matt Tabor was 100% responsible at this point for not allowing me to finish the course with my last tickets, and refused to let me even Solo after all my tandem lessons, I am for the first time in my life contesting it through Visa. Something of which I've never had to do in 67 years. But I paid him $1,400.00 in good faith up front for the course, and because he thought I had put money down on a Glider, became quite upset when I told him, "That's It"! I can't afford any more so at the completion of the course I won't have the funds to order what I intended to at that time. It was that action that started this whole Matt Tabor machine in motion against me finishing the course.

And to make matters even worse, I heard from instructors and 3 different Hang Gliding Flight Parks, in not so plain language how he's done this to so many students it's ridiculous. He will make them fail the course initially so they will have to buy more Tandem Tickets to get through the course at $75.00/ticket.

It's a shame that so many well qualified instructors prostitute themselves out to Matt Tabor for their services. And especially this Shawn character who is no better then a mole that Burroughs his way under the ground. 3 Times I called Shawn and told him I wanted to see this Matt Tabor personally, but he had not the brass to meet me face to face. If ever a man can be associated with a weasel , Matt Tabor Fits this description to a tee,
And here I thought I did all the proper research on Hang Gliding Parks and chose the right one. The instructors are truly all good people, and of course had their sympathy for the way I was treated by the Owner of the Flight Park.

But sympathy doesn't get back the balance of $1,200.00 in lessons that were all in vain, because of the owner's telling all instructors to not pass me. I will post this on the Lookout Mountain Hang Gliding Page also, because it is a sad truth that all should be made aware of, even those considering taking Lessons at that specific Park. Be cautious, because it was people who were directly working for Matt Tabor that told me about the Illegal activities he engages in, forcing students to spend several hundred or more then the cost of the course to pass it. At 67 yrs, and PTSD from 1966, never have I been swindled as I was at Lookout Mountain Hang Gliding Flight Park.

This entire Journey has sealed my mind against ever leaving home again.

Pastor Marc Bialeck
1397 11th Ct
Friendship, Wisconsin

[wingspan33]

I once considered working as a Instructor at Look Out Mountain. My impression of Matt Tabor is what decided the deal - against working there.

There were other factors such as Look Out having one of the worst safety records (as a hang gliding flying site) at that time. More fatalities than any other flying site in the nation.

I also recall unrequested launch assist on my keel during the '88 Nationals. Some idiot was pushing my nose down (to keep me from stalling?) on their launch ramp. When I yelled out "What are you doing?!" this guy said "It's how we do things here.". I had more than enough cliff launch experience to launch safely without his "help". I later found out that since many of Look Out's students are not properly taught how to control pitch during small hill lessons, someone needed to man the keel to keep them from popping the nose and stalling during their initial (minor cliff launch) mountain take offs. Basically, students are not "taught how to fly" they are "taught how to buy" . . . a lesson package including a New glider.

This was many years ago, mind you. The staff had this goal of making the student think they were doing great - but also often telling the student they needed more time to get their Novice rating (than the lesson package which they had purchased allowed).

One time, perhaps when I was visiting, thinking of working there, I began talking with an old guy who was hanging out near launch. He explained that he had once owned the property on which the shop and launch were located. He had sold it to Tabor a good number of years before and explained, mysteriously, that he "didn't really have a choice" in the matter. Could have just been an old guy just telling stories, . . . but who knows?

There's other stuff I became privy to as well.

Still, it's a nice flying site and if you aren't looking to learn there - and just fly - do what you need to do at the shop, then go have fun! And Hennson's Gap is only about an hour away. That's one of the best flying sites in the country.

[Bill Cummings]

I once considered working as a Instructor at Look Out Mountain. My impression of Matt Tabor is what decided the deal - against working there.

There were other factors such as Look Out having one of the worst safety records (as a hang gliding flying site) at that time. More fatalities than any other flying site in the nation.

I also recall unrequested launch assist on my keel during the '88 Nationals. Some idiot was pushing my nose down (to keep me from stalling?) on their launch ramp. When I yelled out "What are you doing?!" this guy said "It's how we do things here.". I had more than enough cliff launch experience to launch safely without his "help". I later found out that since many of Look Out's students are not properly taught how to control pitch during small hill lessons, someone needed to man the keel to keep them from popping the nose and stalling during their initial (minor cliff launch) mountain take offs. Basically, students are not "taught how to fly" they are "taught how to buy" . . . a lesson package including a New glider.

This was many years ago, mind you. The staff had this goal of making the student think they were doing great - but also often telling the student they needed more time to get their Novice rating (than the lesson package which they had purchased allowed).

One time, perhaps when I was visiting, thinking of working there, I began talking with an old guy who was hanging out near launch. He explained that he had once owned the property on which the shop and launch were located. He had sold it to Tabor a good number of years before and explained, mysteriously, that he "didn't really have a choice" in the matter. Could have just been an old guy just telling stories, . . . but who knows?

There's other stuff I became privy to as well.

Still, it's a nice flying site and if you aren't looking to learn there - and just fly - do what you need to do at the shop, then go have fun! And Hennson's Gap is only about an hour away. That's one of the best flying sites in the country.

Wingspan33,
Your story fits exactly with my experience with Matt T. at Lookout.
Years ago during the winter I was headed for Florida with my boat tow rig. I was coming from Minnesota and stopped at Lookout. On the ramp was a woman named Jen, up from Florida, and she was hooked into her Gemini hang glider. Here husband was on the ramp watching. Jen used a cocoon harness with the thumb loop to hold up the bottom part of the harness for take off. It was too light and at times crossing. She was hesitating and all of a sudden Matt yelled, “GO!!” and started pushing the keel. Jen obviously wasn’t ready. The glider got moved ahead of her and the thumb loop pulled her hand off of the down tube and on her first step she accidentally stepped into the harness boot with her left foot and fell prone into the harness. Matt rolled her off the ramp on the base tube wheels. The glider stalled and dove for the tree tops below. Her husband ran to the end of the slab and yelled, “PUSH OUT!!” As Jen got her Gemini out of the dive the base tube was stripping twigs off of the tree tops. She flew to the LZ landed on the wheels and laid there sobbing according to witnesses later in the LZ.
My wife grabbed me by the back of my jacket as I started for Matt and told me to let her husband deal with Matt. I took her advice but advised Jen’s husband to kill the S.O.B.
Down below at a restaurant a server saw my HG, T - shirt and told us that he is a pilot too. We were telling this guy the story and before we got to the unbelievable part he interrupted with, “He rushed her off! Right?”
I said, “Rushed her off?” --- “Hell fire, he pushed her over the end of the ramp on her wheels and then yelled NEXT!”

[brianscharp]

She was hesitating and all of a sudden Matt yelled, “GO!!” and started pushing the keel.

Matt sounds like a nutjob.

[wingspan33]

I don't think a "nutjob". Very shrewd is more like it. My hypothesis would be that Matt is excessively money hungry. The comment he yelled out after force launching Jen was "Next!" That probably meant that she was stopping other pilots from getting their own launches in.

If she was a newer pilot, then conditions (as fits Bill's above description) were probably "mild" (i.e., not soarable). Other new-to-mountain-launching students were probably scheduled to get their first, or not far from first, mountain launches in at the same time. The quicker the students get launched the sooner they gain the skill set leading toward the rating they paid (Lookout Mountain HG Shop/Matt Tabor) to attain. Many Novice launches in mild morning air translates to higher profits for the shop. (In the front door and out the back!)

A master at making money (in the minimal flying/gliding/soaring business) knows exactly how delaying students can earn the HG/PG school money - AND how speeding students along can make the HG/PG school money. For some HG/PG shop/school owners it's of ultimate importance to know which to do and when to do it.

But who knows this could all be a "once upon a time" story and things could be different (better) now.

[brianscharp]

I don't think a "nutjob". Very shrewd is more like it. My hypothesis would be that Matt is excessively money hungry.

I was actually being uncomfortably polite when I used the term nutjob and nothing you wrote makes me want to downgrade it. If you're saying being "very shrewd" or "excessively money hungry" is somehow a justification for what Bill said Matt did then there's room for you in the same category.

[Bill Cummings]

All right you two--- don't make me come over there!

[DaveSchy]

I watched Chirico push a woman pg student off of the north Tiger launch. She was screaming and he had her on radios, but literally pushed her a** off of launch. I was appalled. I wonder, did she pay him in advance?

[brianscharp]

I watched Chirico push a woman pg student off of the north Tiger launch. She was screaming...

Was it this woman further along in her training?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d8xlVKtqfI


viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1865
Flying with children
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_e2QkEnkJo