On 12/20/2017 1:23 PM, Tontar
tontar@comcast.net [CBCC] wrote:
Aaron Swepston writes:
> "If someone like the Blanchard land owner says “okay, the ORA protects us from settlements, so we won’t require you to have insurance coverage for us”, and then someone gets hurt while a recreational activity like hang gliding is taking place on their land, and the injured party sues the landowner, what happens then? That lawsuit has to be answered in court. While at the end of that court case the landowner might be released from any liability and settlement, the entire court process, the defense, has to be mounted on the part of the defendant, the landowner. The Blanchard landowner has to defend himself in court. He has to go into court and wave around the ORA as his defense, or hire an attorney to do it for him. Guess what, that costs money. Who pays that? He does. The ORA “may” prevent him from having to pay a settlement to the injured party, but he has to pay his own legal fees defending that case against him. And THAT is not an acceptable situation to those landowners who know full well about the ORA, and that is why most have chosen to require insurance that will pay their legal fees and actually step in to defend the case against them. That’s not an insignificant distinction between USHPA insurance and the ORA protections.
>
> Knowing that, which land owners will choose to trust in the ORA versus the known protection of liability insurance? I think our site managers and negotiators can answer that pretty well. The site owners CHOOSE insurance over non-insurance and them having to pay legal fees to defend themselves. "
ORA = Outdoor Recreation Act in Swepstonarian acroniminy
My reply to CBCC user list:
Folks,
This, too, is an old, old argument, time to retire that one, Aaron!
Since when is liability insurance a "known protection"? Ever been jerked around by car insurance companies after a wreck?
Trust is built, not purchased, Aaron.
The fact is, that red herring of an "insurance problem" is very simply solved with a well written WAIVER. (We had them at Frailey, that's how we established trust). USHGA had one too, prior to EXPIRING, as does USHPA now.
Now, even LA County is fine with having a waiver for recreational use at Dockweiler (a busy beach just south of world famous Venice Beach). This is instead of ANY USHPA membership or insurance (I think LA just might have fairly deep pockets for a PI lawyer to drool over, and very good lawyers writing this waiver).
Here's the waiver:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/yultargugyoh ... sW5ja?dl=0Section 3 fully addresses Aaron's postulated scenario.
Fact, I just signed this LA County waiver. See the fine print... it says recreational use. As a BUSINESS, Windsports has their own coverage, as they should.
Every hang glider pilot should sign that waiver and send it to LA, as a statement of their continued commitment to self regulation and in support of a true legacy training hill.
A simple sign and waterproof box stating "Waiver required, pilot assumes all liabilities to properties, themselves and others", posted in a conspicuous spot, preferably near launches and at the LZ's gives all the "extra financial protection" necessary.
Boom, the clubs just saved 2 million bucks and yearly site insurance fees, plus the cost of operating an "insurance company". In fact, just such a waiver is required (and very available) at Dog despite having "site insurance"!!! So will some slick, expensive PI lawyer even represent a case like you posit, Aaron?
How many waterproof boxes could we have bought for 2 million bucks? Maybe 10,000? that's 1,000 flying sites (2 boxes each) in every state in the US!
Could that just possibly grow the sport of hang gliding more than this present "insurance"? USHPA is a paragliding club, 2/3 of the dwindling membership fly them, and TOTAL membership is less than 9,000 now.
Less than 3,000 hang glider pilots are presently members of USHPA. Good work by the "Bored"!!!
Is it really worth all the expense, overhead, regulation and hassle of "site insurance" to not have to sign a site waiver before flying, if an owner or agency feels insecure about their existing statutory ORA protection?
Will USHPA's "enforcers" be covered for reconstructive dentistry by the RRG?
Rant away!!!
Happy Solstice from 18966