1) A ghostly double of a living person, especially one that haunts such a person. 2) An evil twin. 3) A remarkably similar double; a lookalike. 4) A monster that takes the forms of people, usually after killing them.
I thought doppelganger meant giant or elephant like' compared to a mouse, as that is how it came across in your first usage. Then you used the term several more times, with inference that we are too helpless to fight back. Mouse to an elephant. Then I looked it up, maybe before you did, and it made your argument even less appealing.
Now, are the people posting on those sites really who they say they are - or are they doppelgangers?
I know Jack Axaopolous is a real person. Do you think not? Ether way your argument against publicizing his crime makes no sense. What am I missing?
Was the disabled veteran,you posted about, crying like a baby by publishing the facts of his censorship? No. He took a shot at the ghost mirror that censored him and he got some positive results and Facebook came across as villain. What's wrong with that?
Gentlemen, I believe you're both right. Jack is a real person ... I've met him myself. At the same time, I believe there are a lot of fake people ("dopplegangers" or "sock puppets") on hangliding.org. I know of at least 2 different real people who've confided in me that they've operated sock puppets on hanggliding.org (and no, I'm not going to say who they are).
The truth is that most of us here on the U.S. Hawks are here because we want to see something better in the sport of hang gliding. Some of us want fair access to sites. Some of us want an open organization that we can be proud of. Some of us want an organization that's free of the PDMC death toll. Some of us want a place for open dialog where people aren't silenced by some bully. We may not each want all of those things, but we can respect that our peers can want different things and still be compatible with what we want for ourselves.
We will be successful to the degree that we can find it in ourselves to support each other even when we're not in perfect alignment at all times on all things.
Jack Axaopoulos has really done some rotten things. His banning of Joe Faust and his changing of Joe's own words after Joe was kicked out says all I would ever want to know about him. These recent actions back up what he's done to me and to Scott and to Warren and to Al and to a bunch of others (probably more than we'll ever know) for years. Warren is right that this needs to become common knowledge in the hang gliding community. It's not the only thing that needs to be common knowledge, but It's pretty high on the list.
I am sorry that we have so many active Jack Axaopoulos topics, but they each point to a fundamental problem that he has caused - and is still causing - in the sport of hang gliding. He has divided the sport into false camps who can't even communicate across his "iron curtain". That's the real reason he kicked out Joe. Joe was creating a path for pilots to know about each other and to find each other outside of Jack's monopoly (the same reason Jack killed the HGAA and tried to kill the Torrey Hawks and the U.S. Hawks). Jack couldn't tolerate that so he tried to goad Joe into breaking a rule (any rule), but Joe kept his cool and didn't take the bait. So Jack just banned him anyway. That's something worth saying until it is fixed.
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization:US Hawks at ushawks.org View my rating at:US Hang Gliding Rating System Every human at every point in history has an opportunity to choose courage over cowardice. Look around and you will find that opportunity in your own time.
I don't recall posting anything political in my post... my thought was, if you're an apolitical organization (EAA), as soon as you knowingly invite a police force representative from a state or nation to give a speech that you know said thugs are going to proclaim about what rules they want you to comply with at your meeting, it is you the organization that is no longer being politically neutral and showing their support for statism (https://www.google.com/search?q=statism - a political system in which the state has substantial centralized control over social and economic affairs).
I just really don't want strangers I've never met before in my life, telling me what I can and can not do, esp. strangers carrying guns who are not proficient with them, that could go off at any time and who have a history of using guns like hammers... if all you think is in terms of hammer, everything looks like a nail . Get scared? Shoot it! Someone doesn't comply with you? Shoot it! Someone runs away from you? Shoot it! Someone carrying a cellphone in his hands walking towards you, that could be a gun? Shoot it! Not any kind of person I want to be in the same room with, at all.
So all I wanted to know was, how could I get them to be what they claimed to be... apolitical. Didn't seem like an unreasonable question to me (as a home schooled free thinking freedom loving anarchist, anyway... as opposed to someone perhaps who has no clue what I'm talking about because they spent their youth in a government designed and funded public school brainwashing internment camp). I know too much about the organization of the US government and what its done in it's past to have any respect for them at all. Slavery, genocide, assassinations, I won't go into the laundry list...
I don't go around telling other people what they can and can not do, and if they don't comply, threaten them with violence... why should I tolerate that poor anti-social behavior from anyone else near me? I don't, I just leave. Do you go around telling strangers what to do, and if they don't do what you say, kidnap them and lock them in a room? I hope not. Why on earth would you invite those kind of people to give a speech at your meeting and threaten your members or guest visitors, for that matter?
My position is, the skies are a commons for everyone to enjoy... I'm pretty plain speaking about it... you can't plant a flag in the air, therefore, you can't claim it as your own to rule; the native americans never sold any sky in any treaty; and the ancient Egyptian goddess of the air (or some other wacky man made up authority) not to mention mother nature had dominion of the skies lonnnnngggg before any alphabet soup organization came along. Their rules, laws, and constitution has no authority over me (you go boy, Lysander Spooner), because I'm sorry, but you just can't make a valid contract with a baby (me) as soon as I'm born, to be a citizen when I don't understand the language of any implied undefined vague social contract even if it were spoken outloud to me at 1 day old, not to mention nor can or will I sign anything at 1 day old with anything that looks like any kind of consentual valid signature. So boom, mic drop.
Participation in the EAA forums was not much of a loss really; their forums are near deserted. Oddly, I am good friends with the local chapters Vice President... but I met him and he became Vice President well after my post. And there are plenty of other nice aviation forums online, like, well, here The internet is a big, vast place and EAA is hardly the only game in town.
But anyway, the point of my post above was, wacky admins will shoot from the hip and ban you for anything, including just disagreeing with your thought pattern or world point of view.
~
My thoughts in general on the wonderful world of pulling words out of a pile and crafting posts for aviation forums and how they are generally received :
(NSFW warning, rap lyrics with... vulgar language - if you are under 18 or sensitive, don't click... or do, who am I to boss you around, be free : - ) )
All your posts are gorgeous poetry to me, even the ones I don't agree with : - ) Humanity is such a multicolored sparkly rainbow of fantastic weirdness...
Choppergirl, when anarchists gain power, they eliminate everyone they don't like. That is what is so nice about a republic. Imperfect as it may be, we still have a voice and a vote. How's your project coming along?
It sounds like you've had a number of bad experiences in your pursuit of flight. I'm sorry about that.
All I can say is that I hope you find the U.S. Hawks to be an organization of fair minded people who care enough about justice to at least speak up when we see injustices. That, for example, is the purpose of this topic. We've seen an injustice, and we are joining our voices (and yours - thanks) to let people know about it.
I wish we had enough clout to reverse Joe's ban and yours. Maybe some day we will. Until then, you're more than welcome to be among birds of a feather here at the U.S. Hawks.
If you want to start a topic about your EAA experiences, that would be a good way to get people thinking about (and maybe working on) your problem. That's how we make the world better - one problem at a time.
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization:US Hawks at ushawks.org View my rating at:US Hang Gliding Rating System Every human at every point in history has an opportunity to choose courage over cowardice. Look around and you will find that opportunity in your own time.
Rick Masters wrote:Alright Warren, no more tongue-in-cheek with you.
Ether way your argument against publicizing his crime makes no sense. What am I missing?
Give me the California legal code violation you find SG guilty of.
Why put yourself in that box? I've never suggested to do anything like that. Lawyers and court are usually only productive for the monied interest and that aint me. This was a problem when Jim Blindrodie Gaar, Len Smith, Doug DuBois and billion dollar bond lawyer, Norman Gaar stole my interest in a Dragonfly aircraft. Did I mention that before? And, what was the point? There was no there, there in the crazy chance of legal victory. The numbers wouldn't add up. Zero sum gain. Nolo contendre in the monied court of law and the dirty lawyer and sonofa lawyer that killed hang gliding for me.
The court system sucks for poor people and fathers in divorce. There again, I lost so much. A beaten man in my 20's, hang gliding was my emotional escape and it wasn't easy with a 24/7 railroad job in Kansas City. Kansas City sucks for hang gliding but I did get a H4 in about 3 years. Jim Gaar is still a H3 after 20 years and "owning" a 'flight park' for "5 years".
But I digress.. sorry. Screw lawyers. Screw the court system, especially in California. Document and publish the crimes against Hang Gliding for historical value. That's all I'm suggesting.
You have the venue, you've got an organization. Use it. Have our own trial and issue a verdict. Publish far and wide. Show Jack Axaopopous for the weasel that he is. The BK and SW rule. What a joke. Expose the mental weakness, the pussyfication of Jack Axaopolous. Publish for the doppelgang that doesn't know what is going on. Go after his click$. Promote Hawks as the alternative web host. The honest one.
I'm not the guy to do this. Too much this or that. Too much baggage, perhaps, but the talent is here to do it. I'm like Tom Sawyer. Paint this fence. It will be great! Rick would be great. You've got Joe and Frank and Bob and Scott and.... as very credible plaintiffs. A mock trial that mocks one big hang gliding phony. Banned of Brothers... OMG!
You guys jump in here and help me out. Winter is coming to this shxxhole of hang gliding and I've got some ant work to do. Sixty degrees for couple days but not for long.
Yeah. Okay. The thing is, I'm not obsessed with hanggliding.org like most here. I don't post there and I rarely visit. I still don't know why the hang glider was in Owens River, for instance.
Most of the stuff on hanggliding.org is day-to-day stuff. Little things. But hang gliding is in trouble. The big issues are often more likely to appear on the US Hawks forum. Trying to discuss big issues on Davis Straub's forum was certainly a mistake. And after the ill-conceived erasures, bannings, changes and manipulations, I would never go to SG's forum. I would like to accomplish something. That is only possible on the US Hawks forum, made possible by BobK.
All the repetitive bitching and moaning about other forums is a waste of time. Heck, I come here and review posts. There is a wealth of information here. If any active hang glider pilots care about disrupting the status quo, they'll come to the Hawks forum. If not, I expect hang gliding to continue to decline under the business as usual that's killing it. Paragliding. USHPA. RRRG. FFFF. Doppelganger forums. Hang glider pilots with an eye toward the future need to disassociate themselves from those things. Those colorful things aren't working.
Rick wrote:All the repetitive bitching and moaning about other forums is a waste of time.
If I thought that everyone on hanggliding.org was like Jack Axaopoulos, then I would agree with Rick 100%. I'd do my best to NOT let them know about the U.S. Hawks or the Torrey Hawks or USHGRS or anything that I cared about. I'd want them to stay as far away from me as possible.
Instead, I see hanggliding.org more like Nazi Germany. Not all the people in Nazi Germany were bad people. It's true that a lot of them were poisoned by the Nazi rhetoric, but a large number were just good people trying to live their lives. I think that's the bulk of the people on hanggliding.org and the Oz Forum. Those are the people we want to reach to help us build an alternative to USHPA.
Jack knows that, and that's why he's rabid about crushing any links that lead out of his little "iron curtain" cage. Jack didn't so much care that Joe Faust was rating pilots. What Jack didn't like was that Joe's links to USHGRS could actually lead out of Jack's closed universe to other alternatives ... including the U.S. Hawks. That's why Jack took the extraordinary step of programming his entire forum to track down and obliterate every reference to USHGRS. He really is just like the Soviet leaders trying to keep their people isolated and trapped behind an "iron curtain" so they would only see one view of the hang gliding world ... his view.
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization:US Hawks at ushawks.org View my rating at:US Hang Gliding Rating System Every human at every point in history has an opportunity to choose courage over cowardice. Look around and you will find that opportunity in your own time.
Every time I open another topic I find another gem.
Rick Masters wrote:Will you look at that? I've made 3150 posts to US Hawks and not one to the USHPA doppleganger sites. Must be a reason. To quote ancient wisdom:
Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.
Walk away.
Rick's post was urging people to walk away from hanggliding.org (one of the "doppleganger" sites), but some would neither walk away nor stay and defend Joe. Either one would have been defensible, but staying while watching Joe be banned was indefensible. That's why there's been no credible defense.
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization:US Hawks at ushawks.org View my rating at:US Hang Gliding Rating System Every human at every point in history has an opportunity to choose courage over cowardice. Look around and you will find that opportunity in your own time.
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Do you go around telling strangers what to do, and if they don't do what you say, kidnap them and lock them in a room? I hope not. Why on earth would you invite those kind of people to give a speech at your meeting and threaten your members or guest visitors, for that matter?
