[TadEareckson]

Nope when you are thought of as a dildeau, you are simply a dildeau.

1. Does it matter WHO thinks of you as a dildeau?

Brian Vant-Hull - 2007/07/21

I'll be lazy and ask if any of your references give a physical reason for the 0.8 to 2 g range they quote as safe. If not, constructing a reasonable physical argument could be a major contribution. You clearly have the physics down well enough (as good as anyone else in the world) to do so.

Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25

Unfortunately, he's stumbled onto some of Tad's old rantings and got suckered in. So most of this was just the same old story of debunking Tad's lunacy... again .

2. If one Davis/Rooney caliber sh*thead thinks of you as a dildeau does that trump one PhD physics teacher? Or does that just make you half a dildeau?

3. I guess if a hundred pin bending Davis/Rooney caliber SH*THEADS think of you as a dildeau you're DEFINITELY a dildeau - no matter what the assessment of the half dozen or so people in hang gliding who AREN'T total morons have to say on the issue.

4. If a hundred Davis/Rooney caliber SH*THEADS get some miracle medication which allows a few synapses to start connecting and they decide you're not a dildeau are you suddenly no longer a dildeau?

5. What if you're in a room with lead shielding?

6. Does it work the other way around?

Mitch Shipley - 2011/01/31

Jim, as I am starting to play with Elektra Tow (ET) at Quest Air (the battery powered "scooter" tow system you and Adam got me jazzed up about up at Highland) I've watched this thread closely. We all can learn.

Enjoy your posts, as always, and find your comments solid, based on hundreds of hours / tows of experience and backed up by a keen intellect/knowledge of the issues when it comes to most things in general and hang gliding AT/Towing in particular. Wanted to go on record in case anyone reading wanted to know one persons comments they should give weight to.

When hundreds of dildeaux think a sh*thead's a genius does that simply make him one?

Nothing noble about that.

I'll take my chances. I've had much better success being a dildeau than with everything else I've tried.

Nope, If you give someone basic respect. Most all will return it.

1. Sorry, I've been f***ed over WAY too many times to buy that bulls***. I'm probably the world's foremost authority on predicting finishing places for nice guys.

2. I give someone the benefit of the doubt and treat him with courtesy - until he almost invariably proves he doesn't deserve it.

3. I don't know where the concept that RESPECT is supposed to be given away without being earned or deserved comes from but it's a monumentally bad idea - especially in this game.

Getting your message to 4-5 people is going to change a lot. Isn't it?

Jason Rogers - 2008/10/14

Thanks for this discussion. I spent most of my flying time at a rounded hill take off, where this really isn't that much of an issue. I don't think I was placing the right sort of importance on being hooked in... So now that I'm flying less "forgiving" sites, you may well have saved my life.

enormydude - 2010/01/11
New South Wales

Lift and Tug - identified my absent leg loop - thank you!

1. Ya never know. If I spend a couple of hundred hours on the keyboard and it keeps the next Rich Alexander from breaking his arm and doing all that nerve damage I'm pretty happy.

2. Beats the crap out of getting "my" message to zero people, doesn't it?

deltaman - 2011/10/14

...some voices ask to impose your barrel release for the French Championship 2012 in the flats near Poitiers. And we will invite the Brits in a FAI cat2 event...

3. Beats the crap out of the 99.9 percent of the people in this sport who have no hints of messages of their own and are too stupid to even take advantage of what's available from people - like Rob Kells and Christian Thoreson - who aren't me.

4. What happens if I get "my" message to four or five people and each of them then gets "my" message to four or five other people. After three cycles you're into the hundreds.

5. What is "my" message? Is "force equals mass times acceleration" "my" message?

6. If "my" message is legitimate...

miguel - 2011/06/23

I have been reading this board for a couple months now. Much good info here.

...wouldn't your time be better spent getting other glider drivers on the right page than discussing my delivery?

Nobody - 2011/09/16

These people are just too stupid to deal with. Nothing I say makes a dent.

You might actual hit upon the magic formula which has evaded the rest of us so successfully all these decades.

Pilgrim - 2011/08/12

I think this pretty much sums things up. What kind of person thinks like this? Absolutely no one I would ever respect, honor or have anything to do with. What a looser. This attitude alone undoes every single thing that guy ever tried to do that was worh while. So what do you have left? Worthlessness with worthless advice. Un f'_cking believable.

6. Maybe I'm structuring my delivery to deliberately get hundreds of Davis/Rooney caliber SH*THEADS think of me as a dildeau in order that they not receive my message that force equals mass times acceleration and thus...

ZackC - 2011/08/12

I judge someone's ideas by their own merit, not my assessment of his character. I'd rather have the best hang gliding instructor in the world than the nicest, even if the best was a total d*ck.

...make extra space in the gene pool for people who don't really give a rat's a** whether or not someone's a dildeau.

Going to someone's house and peeing on the sofa is not going to endear them to you no matter how righteous your cause.

1. It might if there's no water 'cause the pipes are frozen and my 'cause is to extinguish the fire before the baby's asphyxiated. Sometimes ya just gotta go with the best that's available at the time.

2. I'm not going into anyone's house. I'm pushing keys which allow symbols to be displayed on screens. People are free to look at and interpret those symbols or not as they choose.

3. Forums are generally set up and controlled by an individual or two. That doesn't make them their property. If Peter Birren wants to come to Kite Strings and call me a fuckin' ignorant coward and an asswipe he is perfectly free and more than welcome to do so. His posts are HIS thoughts, works, intellectual properties - not mine. Likewise - as far as I'm concerned anyway - US Hawks is owned by the people who contribute their thoughts, works, intellectual properties, time to it - regardless of whose got the key buttons under his fingers.

[TadEareckson]

Nobody - 2011/10/21

Re: instructors and other qualified pilot fiends

I am at a loss. I have yet to figure out how to reason with-

Jim Rooney - 2011/09/02

Please note that the weaklink *saved* her a**. She still piled into the earth despite the weaklink helping her...

Or

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/10/19

A glider doesn't feel like it's pulling you off the hill if you're not hooked in.

Or

Rob Clarkson - 2011/09/04

130 lb greenspot is what most flight parks are using...for every one. So we are talking about a breaking strength of 260lbs...for every one. I'd say that's about 1 -1.5 g for most pilots. Sounds like everyone is in agreement. You can't get week link in 5lb increaments so everyone is at 1.5g.

Yo-Yos that pull this crap out of thin air and post it for all to see. Embarrassing.

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/10/18

The person using the name "Nobody" seems to get it.

Tad Eareckson - 2011/10/20

Are you SURE you wanna stand by a statement that ASTOUNDINGLY CLUELESS?

Are you sure you wanna be keeping company like that? You can start fixing some of this stuff but it would probably be a good idea to do it sooner rather than later.

[TadEareckson]

Rick Masters - 2011/10/19

Al, there's a lot of noise on this thread but if I can just cut through it, I'd like to provide my observations to your excellently detailed account.

A lot of focus is put on hooking in. Too many pilots have died for no good reason. It was never a problem for me. Before lifting the glider, I would lay down and check my distance from the control bar. I always did this. It was part of my unalterable routine. It just took a moment and then I would shoulder the glider. I would stand and allow the wind to lift the wing. I would stand and fly the wing with gentle tension on my hang strap. Then I would identify the neutral lift attitude where the wing weighed nothing - and hold it.

At that moment, I would banish all concern about launching unhooked. I had taken care of it. It was done. It was out of my mind.

Now I would look downslope. I would verify that the bushes or trees below were waving slightly. If they were, I knew that I would encounter lift during and at the end of my run.

Now I would look to one side to see how wide the lift band was AND to see if there was approaching traffic. Then I would look to the other side. If bushes and trees or flags were moving about the same far to either side, I could be assured that I was in uniform ridgelift or in the center of a large thermal updraft. In the event of a large thermal updraft, there is no time to delay because it will not last and you must launch into the first half as it approaches launch.

Now you look to your wireman. His fingers should be "O's" around your nose wires and not touching them. Now you have met all conditions. Timing is of the essence. You yell "Clear!", the wire man dives to the side and you run, holding a neutral angle of attack.

A lot of focus is put on hooking in.

Instead of the focus being put on CHECKS of hook-in status JUST PRIOR TO LAUNCH - like it says in ALL the rating requirements nobody ever bothers to read or comply with. Which is precisely why people launch without their gliders so commonly that it's not considered to be a particularly BFD.

Too many pilots have died for no good reason.

There are virtually ALWAYS about three TOTALLY EXCELLENT reasons people die in this sport - in addition to the major underlying problem of assuming that someone who can fly a hang glider skillfully is a PILOT.

It was never a problem for me.

Yeah. For forty years I always buckled my seat belt when I drove. Then a year and a half ago it suddenly dawned on be that I'd never had a problem in which a seat belt had been any use whatsoever. So I said phuck this and have been just fine ever since.

Before lifting the glider, I would lay down and check my distance from the control bar. I always did this.

1. And - when flying the same glider/harness combo - how many times did you find your distance from the control bar detectably varied?

2. Did you check your leg loops at that point?

3. Are you sure?

It was part of my unalterable routine.

It's part of damn near everybody's unalterable routine.

Rob Kells - 2005/12

My partners - Steve Pearson and Mike Meier - and I have over twenty-five thousand hang glider flights between us and have managed (so far) to have hooked in every time. I also spoke with test pilots Ken Howells and Peter Swanson about their methods (another five thousand flights). Not one of us regularly uses either of the two most popular methods outlined above.

How I wish it weren't.

It just took a moment...

... for the two people involved in the operation...

...and then I would...

...partially regain my footing...

...shoulder the glider...

...and dismiss my assistant.

I would stand and allow the wind to lift the wing. I would stand and fly the wing with gentle tension on my hang strap.

1. Just enough to gently tension your hang strap. Never enough feel a solid tug through your leg loops. Hell, you just checked those fifteen seconds ago when you did your hang check (probably).

2. And if the wind were light or nonexistent - phuck it - you JUST DID a hang check as part of your unalterable routine.

Then I would identify the neutral lift attitude where the wing weighed nothing - and hold it.

Bob Kuczewski - 2011/08/10

By the way, one of the primary methods of controlling a glider on launch is to yaw the glider to control its exposure to the wind. Yawing requires torque, and the only thing you can use to torque a glider is the frictional force of your feet on the ground. Frictional forces are typically defined as the product of the coefficient of friction (a property of the surfaces) times the normal force (the force of your feet on the ground). As the glider begins to lift you, you lose some of that normal force and you proportionally lose your ability to apply torque to the glider. If you combine this with the rapidly increasing forces as you elevate the glider into the wind, you're creating a situation where it's much more likely for the glider to get out of control.

So what you're saying is that all you need to do is trim the glider to neutral and you regain enough traction to apply torque to the glider? DUDE!!! Who'da thunk! Such a simple solution to this problem which has been plaguing untold thousands of glider pilots for so many decades!

At that moment, I would banish all concern about launching unhooked. I had taken care of it. It was done. It was out of my mind.

GREAT!!! Now, because you have followed your special unalterable distraction proof routine you can be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that any time you're standing on a ramp with a glider over you that you're connected to it - and forget all about the USHGA:

With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in just prior to launch.

requirement.

(This gun couldn't POSSIBLY be loaded. I just checked it a minute ago.)

Now I would look downslope. I would verify that the bushes or trees below were waving slightly. If they were, I knew that I would encounter lift during and at the end of my run.

Now I would look to one side to see how wide the lift band was AND to see if there was approaching traffic. Then I would look to the other side. If bushes and trees or flags were moving about the same far to either side, I could be assured that I was in uniform ridgelift or in the center of a large thermal updraft. In the event of a large thermal updraft, there is no time to delay because it will not last and you must launch into the first half as it approaches launch.

Now you look to your wireman. His fingers should be "O's" around your nose wires and not touching them. Now you have met all conditions. Timing is of the essence. You yell "Clear!", the wire man dives to the side and you run, holding a neutral angle of attack.

With each flight, demonstrates a method of establishing that the pilot is hooked in just prior to banishing all concern about launching unhooked, identifying and holding neutral lift attitude, looking downslope, verifying that the bushes or trees below are waving slightly, looking to one side and then the other to see how wide the lift band is and to see if there is approaching traffic, looking to your wireman to verify that his fingers are "O's" around your nose wires and not touching them, and yelling "Clear!" and running, holding a neutral angle of attack.

Under NO CIRCUMSTANCES may you verify your connection two seconds prior to launch by...

1. In the presence of sufficient wind:

-a) briefly nosing the glider up in the wind a couple of degrees until you feel resistance; or

-b) allowing the glider to float in the wind to the restraints of your leg loops.

2. In the absence of sufficient wind:

-a) lifting the glider until resistance is felt at the leg loops; or

-b) launching with tight suspension.

As part of your unalterable routine you long ago banished all concern about launching unhooked and put it out of your mind. And if you did any kind of final verification your routine would be altered. And then it wouldn't be an unalterable routine.

Rick Masters

On July 31 1982, my buddy Bob Dunn was killed at Plowshare after he failed to hook in.

On 1982/07/31 your buddy Bob Dunn was killed at Plowshare because he NEVER ONCE altered his unalterable routine to comply with the USHGA SOPs which had gone into effect fifteen months prior. The stated intent of the revision:

George Whitehill - 1981/05

If, just before committing to a launch, a second check is done EVERY TIME and this is made a HABIT, this tragic mistake could be eliminated. Habit is the key word here. This practice MUST be subconscious on the part of the pilot.

If he had just hiked the goddam glider up a few inches two seconds before launch he'd probably be involved in the conversation here bitching about how dangerous paragliders are. But at that moment all concern about launching unhooked had been banished, he had taken care of it, it was done, it was out of his mind. Just the way it was for EVERYBODY ELSE who's EVER died that way.

And if the guy on his nose making "O's" with his fingers had given a rat's a** about the SOPs he'd have been LOOKING for that check and the day would probably have ended a lot more happily.

And, by contrast...

Rob Kells - 2005/12

Each of us agrees that it is not a particular method, but rather the fear of launching unhooked that makes us diligent to be sure we are hooked in every time before starting the launch run.

bobk - 2011/10/19

Thanks for bringing us back on topic Rick ... and for the good advice.

Advising a new flyer to violate the most fundamental safety rule ever written for foot launched hang gliding is NOT good advice - unless a halfway sane case can be made for doing so. And there isn't one.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Tad,

I've casually warned you about foul language before. This time it's an official warning (#1).

You know the words you can't say on broadcast television? Well you can't say them here either. I've let it slide because I'm trying to rehabilitate you. But you're showing no signs of rehabilitation, and you just get angrier and angrier. So if I see it again, you'll get a second warning. If I see it again after that, then I'm going to confine you to the free speech zone. The free speech zone is one of the areas on the forum that's been set up for search engines (like google) to ignore. Foul language is one of the things that might hurt a site's ranking, and we're trying to reach more people ... not less.

I hope you understand what I've written, and I hope you'll take it seriously. You preach a lot of self control about remembering to lift and tug. I'd like to see you demonstrate that same level of self control regarding your foul language.

Thanks,
Bob Kuczewski

[TadEareckson]

I've casually warned you about foul language before. This time it's an official warning (#1).

1. Is this in accordance with the US Hawks Bylaws and with the recommendation of the Board of Directors? Or are you just making this up as you go along?

2. I'm a little curious about the timing here. Is this happening now 'cause I've been more un Sunday school than usual lately or 'cause I've called you on some monumentally stupid statements and you can't figure out how to get one foot out of your mouth while the other one's still bleeding from the gunshot wounds?

I'm a bit suspicious 'cause if you look at the pattern of my histories of transfers to basements, lockdowns, "suspensions", and bans they always seem to happen right about the time I start scoring bigtime and the opposition has got itself painted into corners.

You know the words you can't say on broadcast television?

Not really. After watching the ABC broadcast of Saving Private Ryan my personal collection was pretty much exhausted.

Well you can't say them here either.

One big difference between the US Hawks and other organizations is that the US Hawks really does honor the free speech of its members. *

* As approved by the US Hawks Dictator For Life, subject to change without notice.

I've let it slide because I'm trying to rehabilitate you.

Can't quite remember when I engaged you as my parole officer / psychiatrist / social worker / priest. Must be the Alzheimer's ramping up.

But you're showing no signs of rehabilitation...

And exactly who was it who qualified YOU to make that determination about ME?

...and you just get angrier and angrier.

Not really. I maxed out a LONG time before we ever crossed paths. And I'm actually having quite a bit of fun right now.

So if I see it again, you'll get a second warning.

GOD NO!!! NOT THE DREADED *SECOND* *WARNING*!!!!!

1. Is it OK if I call someone a motherf*cker if I use an asterisk? Need more asterisks? Is sh*t acceptable 'cause it's got a one to three ratio?

2. Does cr*p need an asterisk or just sh*t? How 'bout the 1977/08/19 D*ck Stark fatality?

3. Are you gonna enforce this "rule" on other people or are ya gonna single out Yours Truly for special attention?

4. Is having a thread title like:

Fall BOD agenda - Reg11, grow some balls

really appropriate for the innocent Christian children who come to this site expecting a wholesome experience? Shouldn't that entitle me to write D*ck Stark without the asterisk?

5. For what pronunciation imagined by the reader am I to be more severely punished if I make a reference to the seventh planet in our solar system? Your anus or urine us?

6. How much does one get to slide? Is it a set number of Forbidden Words or a percentage of the volume of the submissions?

Peter Birren - 2011/08/29

I see you are still trying to pawn off on someone else what you can't do yourself. Fuckin' coward... ignorant coward.

Tad, you ignorant slut...

Care to threaten me with more gunshots to the head? Asswipe!

5. I notice you don't seem to get all that upset when *I'M* under attack.

If I see it again after that, then I'm going to confine you to the free speech zone.

bobk - 2011/10/19

OK, so exactly where have I been a "Current Dictator"? Please name one single instance. There's no need to write War and Peace. Just tell me where I've acted as a "Current Dictator" on this forum?

Guess we've got THAT issue pretty settled now, huh?

The free speech zone is one of the areas on the forum that's been set up for search engines (like google) to ignore.

The FREE Speech Zone. What an ironic name for the it. The place where you just dumped the speech from two participants for the sole reason that the head of your local dictatorship wants it banned. Wouldn't the Banned Speech Zone be a more appropriate name for it?a

Or how 'bout The Basement? Everybody's quite familiar with that concept. The Grand Dictator just kicks anything he feels like down their and pretends he's reflecting The Will of The People.

Good thing the "Free" Speech Zone is hidden from search engines. Now only Zack will be the beneficiary of all that work I did getting him to understand the effects of aerodynamic drag on a surface towline.

Foul language is one of the things that might hurt a site's ranking...

Oh. It MIGHT. You don't know if it WILL, you have no idea if the PRECISE OPPOSITE happens, my hit counters are doing JUST FINE thank you - but just to be on the safe side...

...and we're trying to reach more people ... not less.

1. Try googling:

"Kite Strings"

Pretty vague, nobody tells me what I can and can't say - second page, third from the top last time I looked.

2. At least twenty percent of the first page of top posters is me and people I've brought here (one way or another).

3. Look at the hit counters on the topics I carry.

4. Who's "WE"? Who are the people who authorized you to speak for them? I'm the second highest poster here and I didn't authorize you to speak for me.

I hope you understand what I've written...

Oh yeah. I also understand WHY you've written it - to distract people from the matter of your not dealing with any of the issues which prevent a**holes like Jim Rooney from slaughtering kids like my nephew.

Nobody - 2011/10/20

Bob,

Do you find any discrepancy in this document?

...and I hope you'll take it seriously.

Of COURSE I will!

You preach a lot of self control about remembering to lift and tug.

I guess it would do no good whatsoever to repeat a few thousand more times that lift and tug has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with SELF CONTROL or REMEMBERING, that the whole point is to keep idiots like myself with no self control and crappy memories from killing themselves by establishing a muscle memory response to the beginning of a launch sequence - EXACTLY in accordance with the stated intent of the 1981/05 Pilot Proficiency System revision.

I'd like to see you demonstrate that same level of self control regarding your foul language.

My SELF control - when there's no ice cream in the freezer - is just fine. You're not looking for ME to control me - you're looking for YOU to control me.

We've got different definitions of foul language. Nobody ever got a scraped knee 'cause of any are all of the Carlin Seven. Telling people crap - sorry - cr*p like:

A glider doesn't pull you off the ramp with a slack hang loop!!

is a reasonably good way to get them killed.

At this point I'm STILL willing to help build this organization into something way better than the evil SH*THEADS at USHGA will ever be able to manage by laying a foundation of competence. You wanna go Sam Kellner and impose Jerry Falwell standards and restrictions and marginalize me you're gonna have an enemy which JUST MIGHT be able to do a lot of well deserved damage from the outside.

Mark Forbes - 2011/09/29

It's not just concern for meet directors and policy makers...it's about our continued existence as an association. It's about minimizing the chance of our getting sued out of existence. We're one lawsuit away from that, all the time, and we think hard about it.

USHGA - for very good reason - is afraid of me and other people who know what they're talking about and where the skeletons are buried. So make sure you do adequate cost/benefit analyses before you make any big decisions about what you're gonna do with me.

And maybe while you're thinking about it you could address some REAL issues like:

Nobody - 2011/10/20

Bob,

Do you find any discrepancy in this document?

[Bob Kuczewski]

At this point I'm STILL willing to help build this organization into something way better than the evil SH*THEADS at USHGA will ever be able to manage by laying a foundation of competence.

Warning #2. One more and you're in the unlisted Free Speech Zone.

I've given a lot of thought to how to deal with your situation Tad. I do think you have some good ideas, but you have a pathological way of expressing them that undermines what you're trying to say. I think it happens because your real need is to be continuously victorious in arguments, and so you'll escalate every comment someone makes into a jihad. This is not helping you at all. I used to read every one of your posts - sometimes I read them two or three times. And I used to read every word of the documents you referred to me. But I don't anymore. I barely skim what you write these days because it's such a waste of my time. That's a shame, but unfortunately, you're not able to take any of the blame yourself. This makes it very hard to for anyone to help you correct this problem.

But I don't give up easily, and I would really like to keep your input visible on this forum. So I'd like to make a suggestion. I doubt you'll accept it, and even if you did, I doubt that you can stick to it. But I'll offer it just the same.

Since you have such a difficult time being civil and you cannot seem to tell when your fingers are typing words like "sh*thead", then I would like to suggest that you make all of your actual posts over on KiteStrings. You can insert posts here (on US Hawks) with links that direct people to your posts on KiteStrings with a short (one line?) summary of what they'll find there (without the profanity). This accomplishes several goals:

1. It lets you reach all the readers of the US Hawks forum (not so many now, but we're hoping to grow).
2. It draws people to your site. Believe it or not, I'm supportive of that (note the link to your site on our home page).
3. It increases your site's ranking by having links from another site.
4. It keeps the US Hawks from being over-run with your posts.
5. It allows you to use whatever language you want in your KiteStrings posts with links from US Hawks.
6. It keeps you from being confined to the Free Speech Zone, so your message will reach more people.
7. It will help demonstrate that you have the self-discipline to follow an agreement without technological handcuffs.

I think that's a pretty good list of reasons for you to consider. Otherwise, I doubt that you can control your fingers long enough to avoid being restricted to the Free Speech Zone in short order. Maybe you can prove me wrong. Please consider this. Thanks.

As for Nobody's request for me to read a document, I haven't found the time yet. I'm sorry, but I don't have time to read everything that everyone asks me to read. I would eventually like to form committees with expertise in each area, and I've asked you (Tad) to be a part of that, but I think you get more enjoyment as a keyboard warrior than in actually sitting down to accomplish positive goals.

As for the dictatorship comments, I am doing my best to build an alternative to the monopoly that USHPA now holds. I could use some help, but you just want to throw rocks. I'd like to build an elected Board of Directors, but I haven't had many qualified volunteers so far. So I'm doing my best until then. If you don't like it, then please build an alternative organization yourself. If it provides what I need to fly, then I might be one of your first paying members. Please keep us posted!!

The balls are all in your court (no pun intended).

Bob Kuczewski

P.S. You also mentioned Jack's "basement", and to be honest, I'd be relatively satisfied being able to post there. But Jack won't allow it because I'd get too many readers there who might agree with me. If I end up sending you to the "Free Speech Zone", it won't be because you don't agree with me or that you'll gather a following there (in fact, I hope you do!!). It will be because your foul language (regardless of how many asterisks you use) continues to undermine the viability of this forum. The same is true of your acidic remarks (wishing certain people would die in a hang glider accident). If you want to test me on that theory, then please refrain from those kinds of remarks and see the results. Thanks.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Ooops, one more comment ...

1. Try googling:

"Kite Strings"

Pretty vague, nobody tells me what I can and can't say - second page, third from the top last time I looked.

Great!! Now try googling "US Hawks".

You'll find that term is often used in connection with US politics, but "US Hawks Hang Gliding Association" still comes up on the first page (third from the top) despite the common use of those terms in other contexts. Here's the result of my search today:

ushawks_google_us_hawks_2011_10_23.png (76.93 KiB) Viewed 4459 times

Of course, the real test isn't whether you find KiteStrings when you search for "Kite Strings" or find US Hawks when you search for "US Hawks". The real test is what you get when searching for "hang gliding". I currently find US Hawks on page 23, but I went all the way up to page 50 and still didn't find Kite Strings (your results may vary). We might do even better if we didn't have you (Tad) littering our forum with foul language!

[TadEareckson]

Warning #2.

THAT used up my second warning?!?!?! And I WASTED it on SH*THEADS?!?!?! Solely because I was making an effort to be NICE?

Any way I can edit my post and substitute something more honest, accurate, and cost effective?

One more and you're in the unlisted Free Speech Zone.

You REALLY need to come up with a better name for that place.

No, scratch that. It's so DELICIOUSLY Orwellian - leave it just like it is. It rivals one of my all-time favorites:

Michael Hoffman - 2010/10/19

This situation just has WRONG wrote all over it. Is this where a USHPA accident crew should be sent to the scene to do interviews. I wonder if there was anybody there that knew what they were doing. Goes to show that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. As an H2, I only fly when there is an instructor or other qualified pilot fiends there. Thanks to them for their time and attention to safety, I have logged over a hundred flights without an accident. They say stick with the winners and for me those are the ones doing it safely year after year.

I've given a lot of thought to how to deal with your situation Tad.

Instead of giving a lot of thought to some situation that actually matters - like how do we convince glider divers that when a regulation states that a verification of hook-in status is to be made JUST PRIOR TO LAUNCH that ten minutes falls a bit outside of the definition.

Maybe the "situation" doesn't really exist outside of your imagination. What would happen if you simply did NOTHING? Would US Hawks instantly and completely collapse? Or would its active participation level continue to grow - as I believe it has since I've been an active participant?

I do think you have some good ideas, but you have a pathological way of expressing them that undermines what you're trying to say.

Then some brave US Hawks volunteer can don a biohazard suit, wade through them, and restate them in a non pathological way.

I think it happens because your real need is to be continuously victorious in arguments, and so you'll escalate every comment someone makes into a jihad.

1. My "ARGUMENT" is two plus two equals four.

2. Whenever someone else ARGUES that two plus two equals what "WE" say it does because:

Jim Rooney - 2011/08/24

We've been doing this a long time and are quite familiar and comfortable with our processes.

people (like my nephew) get mangled and killed.

3. So yeah, when somebody states three or five there's gonna be a jihad until we can get a consensus on four and Al's chances for long term survival take a sharp upswing.

4. You'll notice that I don't escalate EVERY comment someone makes into a jihad.

I've read and skimmed a lot of what Rick has to say about flying paragliders in thermal conditions under five hundred feet. That was pretty eye opening for me. I think I told you that my nephew was recently drooling after observing some paragliders skimming low in smooth conditions. I relayed what I had learned from/through Rick. Maybe that saved his life. (Thanks Rick.)

But when Rick advises people to follow a particular procedure then ASSUME they're hooked in from that point on to whenever things look good for running off the ramp I'm gonna say something - again.

This is not helping you at all.

1. What's your data on that?

2. This isn't about helping ME. This is about helping HANG GLIDING. If "my" ideas are good/solid then use them and stop worrying so much about helping ME.

I used to read every one of your posts - sometimes I read them two or three times. And I used to read every word of the documents you referred to me. But I don't anymore. I barely skim what you write these days because it's such a waste of my time.

1. I'm so very confused. At the beginning of the paragraph my ideas were good - but now they're a waste of your time.

Oh well, try reading something else then. Have you read...

Peter Birren

The excellent book, Towing Aloft, by Dennis Pagen and Bill Bryden...

...the excellent book, Towing Aloft, by Dennis Pagen and Bill Bryden - and compared/contrasted with "my" good ideas?

That's a shame, but unfortunately, you're not able to take any of the blame yourself.

I'm not responsible for what you choose to read or ignore.

This makes it very hard to for anyone to help you correct this problem.

I'm not positive EVERYBODY perceives that I have a problem needing correcting. Antoine, for example, struggles in a second language to read every word of my posts, sometimes three or four times, and keeps asking for more. And some European pins are now getting straightened. He's spending his time fixing some of the nuts and bolts of hang gliding instead of wasting his time worrying about how to fix me.

But I don't give up easily...

I so wish you would and move on to something useful.

...and I would really like to keep your input visible on this forum.

Suggestion One: First, do no harm. (That's the one all the doctors hafta sign on to.)

Suggestion Two: Second, undo the harm you've already done. Pull my input out of The Basement - sorry - Free Speech Zone, put it back where in belongs, and tell your buddy Sam that if he wants to be a US Hawks chapter he's gotta conform to US Hawks principles. Otherwise he can start looking for another national hang gliding association which doesn't have any principles. (Shouldn't take all that long.)

So I'd like to make a suggestion. I doubt you'll accept it, and even if you did, I doubt that you can stick to it. But I'll offer it just the same.

Since you have such a difficult time being civil and you cannot seem to tell when your fingers are typing words like "sh*thead", then I would like to suggest that you make all of your actual posts over on KiteStrings.

1. I don't have a difficult time being civil. I LOVE civil conversations (ones about SH*THEADS being amongst my favorites). But when I say two plus two equals four and the person I'm engaging says:

It always amazes to hear know it all pilots arguing with the professional pilots.
I mean seriously, this is our job.
We do more tows in a day than they do in a month (year for most).

We *might* have an idea of how this stuff works.
They *might* do well to listen.
Not that they will, mind you... cuz they *know*.

there's gonna be some MORE incivility. Civility isn't the answer to everything. Sometimes you've gotta hunt the sonuvabitch down, haul him out of the pipe, and shoot him in the head. (Yeah, I found that disturbing but I'm pretty sure that if I had had done to me what he did to them I'd have had a similar response.) Gandhi/King civil disobedience doesn't work in all environments.

2. You seem to be totally blind to PASSIVE incivility - which is really the vilest form and one of the biggest killers in this sport.

Peter Birren comes over here, calls me an asswipe, and attempts to make a feeble defense of his idiot lunatic positions that he's used to having internationally universally praised. I'm fine with that. But then when his idiot lunatic positions start getting shredded he just turns his back in the middle of the conversation, slinks away, and leaves all his ticking time bombs and land mines scattered all over the landscape. And that's not incivility?

3. What? Is "sh*thead" supposed to by hyphenated? I ran a spell-check on my post and it didn't flag. And all my fingers still seem to be doing what I tell them to.

You can insert posts here with links that direct people to your posts on KiteStrings with a short (one line?) summary of what they'll find there (without the profanity). This accomplishes several goals:

1. It lets you reach all the readers of the US Hawks forum (not so many now, but we're hoping to grow).
2. It draws people to your site. Believe it or not, I'm supportive of that (note the link to your site on our home page).
3. It increases your site's ranking by having links from another site.
4. It keeps the US Hawks from being over-run with your posts.
5. It allows you to use whatever language you want in your KiteStrings posts with links from US Hawks.
6. It keeps you from being confined to the Free Speech Zone, so your message will reach more people.
7. It will help demonstrate that you have the self-discipline to follow an agreement without technological handcuffs.

1. That's kind of an awkward way of communication and it will not work very well. It's so much easier to allow all people who don't want to read my posts to not read them.

2. The kind of people who will benefit from and/or be an asset to my site are about one in a thousand or fewer. Kite Strings is probably maxed out already.

3. I'm not worried about my site's ranking, it's already successful beyond my wildest dreams, and - as per above - the people I'm gonna and wanna get are there already.

4. Overrunning...

-A. Oh. MY posts are overrunning US Hawks. My current post count (including this one) is 274, a rather distant second to yours of 854, but it's MY posts that are overrunning US Hawks. Maybe you should run the math on that one another time or two.

-B. And the problem with my posts overrunning Hawks is that all Hawks members and guests have guns to their heads and their eyes taped open and are being forced to read all of them, sometimes two or three times?

-C. Having Hawks overrun with all my posts is a helluva lot better than having it an SGAA style ghost town - which, for some extended periods, it would've been in the absence of my posts.

-D. Why don't you retaliate by coming over to Kite Strings and following up on some of those discussions? I'd be DELIGHTED to have someone over there challenging my post ranking.

5. I don't understand why one can't use whatever language one feels like to express honest ideas about actual issues. But if you want Hawks regulated under idiot FCC "rules" maybe you could just ask the FCC to regulate our discussions.

6. The only thing that can confine me to the "Free Speech" Zone is an arbitrary decision made by you.

7. So if I don't conform to YOUR arbitrary speech standards it's because I have a nasty case Self Discipline Deficiency Disorder?

I think that's a pretty good list of reasons for you to consider. Otherwise, I doubt that you can control your fingers long enough to avoid being restricted to the Free Speech Zone in short order. Maybe you can prove me wrong. Please consider this. Thanks.

I can control my fingers JUST FINE, thank you. But I REALLY don't like anybody else trying to control them. And at Kite Strings I don't try to control the output of anybody's fingers - 'cept for spammers.

As for Nobody's request for me to read a document, I haven't found the time yet. I'm sorry, but I don't have time to read everything that everyone asks me to read.

1. That is one of two documents (the other being the Aerotowing SOPs) that were the center of The Great USHGA Firestorm of 2009. And it's pretty obvious that nobody involved in creating, stoking, or fanning The Firestorm ever read either one of them.

2. Combined - minus the Guidelines table of contents - they're a little over 26 typewritten pages, the vast majority of which is empty space.

3. According to this statement:

And I used to read every word of the documents you referred to me.

you've already read it 'cause I first referred you to it on 2011/02/21 - ten days after the beginning of my participation in this forum. And I've lost count of the number of times since.

4. Nobody and Yours Truly aren't "everybody".

5. If you don't have time to read those documents you don't have time to waste on trivial crap like restricting people from referring to the Tillman/Taber crowd as evil SH*THEADS and playing one, two, three games.

I would eventually like to form committees with expertise in each area...

The LAST thing we want on the Towing Committee is people with EXPERTISE in the area.

Jim Rooney - 2011/08/25

See, the thing is... "we", the people that work at and run aerotow parks, have a long track record.
This stuff isn't new, and has been slowly refined over decades.
We have done quite literally hundreds of thousands of tows.
We know what we're doing.

People with expertise are the PROBLEM - not the solution. Virtually all the people with expertise are 130 pound Greenspot pin bending morons like Rooney, Bo, and Davis who've kept aerotowing the sewer it's been for decades.

We need people with ten year old kid brains and common sense who've preferably never been anywhere near a hang glider or any hang gliding people.

...and I've asked you (Tad) to be a part of that, but I think you get more enjoyment as a keyboard warrior than in actually sitting down to accomplish positive goals.

1. What the hell has Hawks done to accomplish any positive goals in these areas?

2. Have you got more people doing hook-in checks and using better releases and bridles and sane weak links?

Has it adopted any sane towing standards?

Or is it too busy moving towing discussions to The Basement and worrying about the Tillman/Taber crowd being referred to as SH*THEADS?

3. These - as you've said yourself - ARE WARS. Wars need warriors, our wars are being fought on keyboards, and thus good keyboard warriors (Thomas Jefferson comes to mind) are fundamental to the accomplishment of positive goals - and have been in any war you wanna name going back to the era when they were fought with rocks.

As for the dictatorship comments, I am doing my best to build an alternative to the monopoly that USHPA now holds. I could use some help, but you just want to throw rocks.

If you haven't even bothered to read my Guidelines after over seven months how the hell would you know?

I'd like to build an elected Board of Directors, but I haven't had many qualified volunteers so far.

1. I hereby volunteer to chair the Safety and Training and Towing Committees. And I've got qualifications - going back thirty years - in those departments coming out my a** by any standards anybody wants to name.

2. Who gets to decide who's "QUALIFIED"? Any actual STANDARDS involved or is it all up to the whims of the person with his fingers on the buttons?

So I'm doing my best until then. If you don't like it, then please build an alternative organization yourself.

Jim Rooney - 2011/08/31

Love it or leave it. I don't care.

Oh. YOU'RE trying your best to build a better organization.

...I would eventually like to form committees...
...I am doing my best to build an alternative...
...I could use some help...
...I'd like to build an elected Board...
...I haven't had many qualified volunteers...
...I'm doing my best...

That's an awful lot of first person singulars for an alternative national organization that's well into its second year of operation.

If it provides what I need to fly, then I might be one of your first paying members. Please keep us posted!!

I can provide equipment designs, training, procedures, and regulations you need to fly - for free. That's WAY above and beyond the call of duty. Other people can spearhead other efforts - but I'm gonna have comments on them if they start derailing.

The balls are all in your court (no pun intended).

Great. Just deal with the balls when they come back over the net and don't tell me how I'm allowed to swing my backhand.

If I end up sending you to the "Free Speech Zone", it won't be because you don't agree with me or that you'll gather a following there (in fact, I hope you do!!).

I have no desire whatsoever to gather a "FOLLOWING".

Jim Gaar - 2009/09/18

I'm a Rooney follower.

Followers are IDIOTS. I want people to understand the physics, logic, and human dynamics of flying these things, become self sustaining, and render me redundant so I can go off and die somewhere without being missed. I'm fine with having people consulting me whenever they need help understanding something.

Zack C - 2010/10/15

Speaking of which, while I can fault Tad's approach, I can't fault his logic, nor have I seen anyone here try to refute it.

Ridgerodent - 2011/08/25

I have been trying to fault Tad's logic and so far been unsuccessful.

But if they're following me I've failed in what I'm trying to do.

It will be because your foul language (regardless of how many asterisks you use) continues to undermine the viability of this forum.

Merriam-Webster's #1 Word of the Year for 2006:

truthiness (noun)

1: "truth that comes from the gut, not books" (Stephen Colbert, Comedy Central's "The Colbert Report," October 2005)

2: "the quality of preferring concepts or facts one wishes to be true, rather than concepts or facts known to be true" (American Dialect Society, January 2006)

The same is true of your acidic remarks (wishing certain people would die in a hang glider accident).

Wishing someone one would die in a hang gliding accident is like wishing someone to be run through by a unicorn. Hang gliding accidents and unicorns are both fictional animals - they don't exist in real life.

1. Rooney comes off the cart, centerpunches a thermal or dust devil - a la Aasletten, Pagen, or Birren - and goes up like a rocket.

2. His 130 pound Greenspot blows when he's standing on his tail to increase the safety of the towing operation. PERIOD.

3. He whipstalls and breaks his freakin' neck.

4. The YouTube video goes viral before Ridgely and USHGA can suppress it.

Manned Kiting
The Basic Handbook of Tow Launched Hang Gliding
Daniel F. Poynter
1974

"The greatest dangers are a rope break or a premature release." - Richard Johnson

5. Highland Aerosports gets the crap fined out of it by the FAA, gets kicked out of the airport, and ceases to exist.

6. A few folk start posting some of Tad's blatherings, people FINALLY GET IT, and we return to the common sense approach of 1974.

Justice is done, the gene pool improves, an evil empire is destroyed, towing becomes safer for everyone on the planet, hang gliding is given the opportunity to start moving forward again. Can anybody point to a DOWNSIDE in this scenario?

And anyway...

bobk - 2011/10/18

Tad, you're not satisfied being the "hook in police". Now you want to be the THOUGHT POLICE.

...I was under the impression that you had a problem with thought police.

If you want to test me on that theory, then please refrain from those kinds of remarks and see the results.

Sure. Just as soon as you figure out what kind of yardstick can be used to yield meaningful results and set up the experiment to remove all the other variables that could have influences on the measurements.

...but I went all the way up to page 50 and still didn't find Kite Strings...

Kite Strings isn't geared or intended for the typical bozo who wants to learn how to run off a cliff and fly like a bird. It's geared for people who are or want to be pilots, realize or suspect that something's rotten in Denmark, and want to fix it for themselves and, hopefully, others.

Kite Strings and some of my other efforts come up real high on searches like:

"aerotow release" "hang glider"
"weak link" glider
"failure to hook in"

We might do even better if we didn't have you (Tad) littering our forum with foul language!

But you have absolutely no way of knowing or finding out and never will so there's not much point in repetitions of this unsupportable speculation.

And - with what YOU characterize as "foul language" or not - it would be pretty tough to argue that Hawks would have numbers anywhere near as good it does minus my participation.