[Bob Kuczewski]

Modern History of the Torrey Pines Soaring Council

This topic recites the recent history of the Torrey Pines Soaring Council leading up to it's April 2007 meeting and the subsequent efforts to obtain a fair and balanced Council which continue to this day. The story is documented with many of the email messages exchanged leading up to the reformation of the modern Council and beyond.

NOTE: This is currently a locked work in progress. I have hundreds of email messages that need to be sorted and posted before this is a complete work. If you have additional information to contribute to this history, please contact me at 858-204-7499 or via email bobkuczewski@gmail.com or through a PM (Personal Message) on this forum. Thanks for your patience.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Background

The modern Torrey Pines Soaring Council was reconstituted based on the needs observed at the Torrey Pines Gliderport from 2004 through 2006. During that time, David Jebb (the concessionaire) became increasingly abusive of pilots flying at the site. These abuses included all forms of flight to some degree, but those piloting hang gliders and RCs were the most frequent targets.

I knew of the problems through my own encounters with David Jebb, but I also began hearing stories of other pilots who'd been bullied at that site. In fact, it had gotten so bad that I took the time to go to the City of San Diego to get a copy of the Torrey Pines lease in late 2005 to investigate what could be done. But I didn't take any action until nearly a year later. As history would have it, it would be the case against David Beardslee which would eventually lead to the reconstitution of the modern day Soaring Council.

I didn't know David Beardslee at that time, but he was introduced to me through a mutual friend who thought I might help. At that time, David Jebb had banned Beardslee (for life) from the Torrey Pines property without any due process or documentation of what Beardslee had done wrong. I initially thought I'd get involved by helping Dave Beardslee understand the process of dealing with the City of San Diego. So we took a "field trip" down to the City Council where I showed Dave the proper forms to fill out to address the Council. Neither of us spoke during that visit, but the seeds of action had been sewn.

[Bob Kuczewski]

WHEREAS ... Soaring Council!!

While reviewing the Torrey Pines lease agreement, I was struck with the following quote in the "RECITALS" section of the lease:

WHEREAS, Flight Director/LESSEE will consult with the Torrey Pines Soaring Council, which represents all soaring user groups, in forming the above mentioned rules and regulations.

That was the first time I'd ever heard of the "Soaring Council", so I began to ask around about it. At that time, the management was so oppressive that I feared repercussions if they found out that I was asking about the Council. So I was very careful with my contacts. After some tips from friends and some searching on the web, I came across an email address for Gary Fogel. The address was gliderrc@aol.com, and I sent the following message on December 8th, 2006 to see if anyone would respond:

Hello Gary,

I was browsing the web and came across this address for you at:

http://www.tpghs.org/SoaringCouncil.html

The pages at that site are badly out of date, so please let me know if this is still a valid address for you.

Thanks,
Bob K.

I never got an answer from Gary Fogel to that message, but I eventually got in touch with him through other means.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Torrey Pines Gulls / Gary and Larry Fogel

In 2006, I began learning to fly RC planes with lots of help from the good people in the Torrey Pines Gulls RC club (special thanks to Parviz K. and John B. for their time). I had spoken with Gary Fogel on the phone, and I attended their 2006 Christmas party where I hoped to meet him in person. Unfortunately, Gary wasn't able to make it, but I contacted him by email the next day on December 13th, 2006:

Hello Gary,

I'm sorry that you weren't able to make the Christmas party last night. I enjoyed many conversations with members and other attendees. The topic of the Soaring Council came up, and I was advised that it might be the place to start. As a result, I've drafted a short email message inquiring about the next meeting (to hopefully get the ball rolling). I'll be sending it to Cliff (TP Gulls president) and several others. I'd like to know if you'd like to be included in that list of recipients. Please let me know as soon as you can, so I can send it off.

Thanks for all of your time so far,
Bob Kuczewski

I also began researching the name of "Fogel" connected with the Gliderport and found the following letter from Larry Fogel (Gary's father) on-line:

August 8, 2002

Mr. David Jebb
Torrey Pines Gliderport
2800 Torrey Pines Scenic Drive
San Diego, CA 92037

Dear Mr. Jebb,

Your very recent concern for flight safety at the Torrey Pines Gliderport should be commended; however, you appear to be using flight safety as a way to remove radio-controlled model soaring from this site.

The Academy of Model Aeronautics (AMA) insurance covering this activity at Torrey Pines is fully documented with Christian Anderson, City of San Diego Real Estate Assets Department. You may obtain a copy of this from him. This insurance "policy provides broad and unique coverage for flying site owners, protecting them from potential liability for injury or damage resulting from club activities on a flying site.

Royal Surplus Lines Insurance Company has an A.M. Best rating of A, IXV and is a member of the Royal & Sun Alliance Group, one of the world's largest insurance organizations. Authorization for AMA to issue certificates of insurance naming site owners as additional insured. This is the equivalent of issuing an endorsement to the policy and assures the site owner of coverage equal to or exceeding coverage for AMA, it's members and clubs. Site owner's coverage is primary. This means that the AMA policy pays on the site owner's behalf without involvement of the site owner's own insurance. Acts voiding coverage by any other insured do not apply to site owners. Should an AMA member or club either do something, or fail to do something that voids coverage for that member or club, the site owner still has coverage under this policy. Contractual liability coverage. This coverage clause reinforces the club's contractual obligations (if any) to indemnify and hold harmless the site owner for injury or damage in connection with the club's use of the site. Non-owned auto coverage for site owners when required by contract. This policy protects the site owner in the event of an auto accident on-site that result in a claim against the site owner. The $2,500,000 aggregate limit of liability applies per location (flying site). This limit of liability usually exceeds the site owner's requirements and the per location aggregate means the site owner does not share the limit with other site owners. It has the effect of a separate policy for each site owner. The insurer must give AMA 150 days notice of cancellation or non-renewal. This allows ample time for AMA to replace the coverage and to notify certificate holders of the change in coverage. AMA pays the entire annual premium at the beginning of the policy year so the policy cannot be canceled for non-payment." (ref. Letter from Carl Maroney, AMA to Christian Anderson dated August 7, 2002).

If you wish to have Air California Adventure, LLC co-insured, you simply have to request this in writing to either or both of the AMA chartered radio-controlled model clubs (Torrey Pines Gulls, Torrey Pines Scale Soaring Society) so that they can name you as additionally insured. There is a filing fee of $20 for each action (paid for by the club(s)).

You indicate that flight safety at the Torrey Pines Gliderport has been deteriorating for some time: "there are been at least 18 collisions of RC craft with manned craft at the site in the last two years" "In the month of June 2002, there were at least 8 RC crashes. In July 2002 there were 8 reported crashes." Evidently, the increasing traffic of paragliders (domestic and foreign) and trainees has made for a dangerous situation. We would certainly appreciate copies of the Incident Reports documenting each of these events, where they occurred along the cliff, who were the pilots involved, statements from each pilot, and any actions taken on your part to rectify these situations. We should then determine what new conditions contribute to the recent decline in safety.

The flight safety rules at Torrey Pines were first adopted in 1978, revised in 1995 with Richard Hanson, Vice President of AMA present. These are essentially the same as the rules currently posted at the gliderport. They are indeed consistent with the AMA Safety Code. In signing the lease you accepted these flight rules. This can only mean that you are admitting that the flight safety rules posted at the cliff are not being properly enforced. Your lack of "competent management" places you in direct violation of Section 1.6 of your lease.

There are a number of remedies for this deteriorating situation. For example, the flight times or airspace can be completely separated for models and ultralight aircraft (rather than the complete removal of either form of motorless flight). Your banning of radio-controlled flight indicates your bias (that you believe the entire fault for the incidents lies with the radio-controlled modelers). Your unwillingness to call upon the Torrey Pines Soaring Council to adjudicate this matter indicates a lack of concern for this long-standing procedure (originally established by the City). This is also in direct violation of your lease that states "Flight Director/LESSEE will consult with the Torrey Pines Soaring Council, which represents all soaring user groups in forming the above mentioned rules and regulations" (Recital 4). Further, your lease states that this is a "historical non-powered flight park." The historical uses include full-scale sailplanes, radio-controlled sailplanes, hang gliders, and paragliders. This is also reflected in the Torrey Pines Gliderport historical marker that refers to "all forms of motorless flight." This public facility must remain just that. Any competent manager would find effective and safe ways for all forms of motorless flight to co-exist rather than simply ban any one form of flight. Incidentally, you will be held responsible for any destruction of club property that was placed on this site with your prior consent.

Evidently, your desire to build an increasingly profitable paragliding operation has already greatly reduced hang glider flying at the cliff. You have greatly reduced radio-controlled operations at the cliff by increasing the daily fee beyond the point affordable by younger and retired pilots. Clearly you have a major conflict of interest between profit and flight safety. You can show your willingness to have equitable flight at the gliderport by shutting down all flight operations until this issue is resolved. You may expect appropriate legal action on this matter. Copies of this letter are being forwarded to all interested parties.

Sincerely,
Lawrence J. Fogel
AMA representative, Torrey Pines Soaring Council
858 455-6449

Wow!!           Larry Fogel (an RC pilot) had written to Jebb:

  "Evidently, your desire to build an increasingly profitable paragliding
  operation has already greatly reduced hang glider flying at the cliff."

He nailed it!! Even an RC pilot could see what was happening to hang gliding back in August of 2002!!

Larry also identified the breakdown with the Soaring Council as part of the problem. Larry wrote:

Your unwillingness to call upon the Torrey Pines Soaring Council to adjudicate this matter indicates a lack of concern for this long-standing procedure (originally established by the City). This is also in direct violation of your lease that states "Flight Director/LESSEE will consult with the Torrey Pines Soaring Council, which represents all soaring user groups in forming the above mentioned rules and regulations" (Recital 4).

Larry Fogel was quoting the lease to support his position that the Torrey Pines Soaring Council should be used to "adjudicate" the banning of RC pilots. That was exactly the position that I had taken from my own independent review of the matter. Larry Fogel was rocketing to the top of my "hero" list in December of 2006.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Gary Fogel Writes Back

I heard back from Gary Fogel that same day (December 13th, 2006):

Bob,
Good to hear from you. Sorry I wasn't able to make the X-mas party as well.

The last Soaring Council members I have record for were:

Tad Hurst (Torrey Pines Paraglider Association)
Scott Kemp (San Diego Hang Gliding Paragliding Assn.)
Alan Chuculate (USHGA)
John Davies, President (Torrey Pines Gulls)
David Laney (Torrey Pines Scale Soaring Society)
Larry Fogel (Academy of Model Aeronautics)
Ed Slater (Associated Glider Clubs of Southern California)
Gary Fogel (Soaring Society of America)

Ed Slater is currently proceeding with the paperwork for the full scale sailplanes to fly at Torrey in spring 2007. I'm assisting in this regard given that I was in charge of that paperwork for the last 6 or so years. Ed might be interested in reserving if there was something to discuss and some means of communicating it to the City. Ed can be reached at Edward.Slater@sdcounty.ca.gov

As mentioned, Alan is deceased. John Davies is also deceased. I was initially asked by the SSA to be their representative given the amount of work I did to protect the site for the full scale sailplanes. I would only be interested in continuing service on a soaring council if it had teeth with the City. I'm confident my father feels the same. In fact I doubt my father would be interested in continuing service given what Jebb has become.

I'm interested in being on the list of recipients only to better understand what is going on. I think the idea of rekindling the soaring council is a good one.

I think the real strategy for success for a revised soaring council is to first identify who within the City would be the proper point of contact, probably within the City Real Estate Assets Dept. Ed Slater might help here because he has just identified the right person to handle the paperwork in Real Estate at the City for the full scale soaring...you might tell him I sent you in his direction. Without a City liason at future meetings, its all pretty pointless I'm afraid, and not worth the time. If you can identify a City liason willing to assist, I might be interested in continuing service, but I think it would of course be appropriate for all parent organization to re-certify their liason in writing.

I'll be in the office tomorrow...we can chat further...

Best regards,
Gary

P.S. Do you know the current state of the former "Torrey Pines Advisory Board"? Is it still in existence?

In retrospect (over 5 years later) it's interesting to note two points:

First - The Soaring Council list that Gary gave me in December of 2006 included 8 clubs - 3 for hang gliding and paragliding combined. But when the Council was actually re-established in spring of 2007, Gary only included 2 clubs for hang gliding and paragliding combined. Somewhere between December and April we (hang gliding and paragliding) lost a voting seat on the Soaring Council for our combined sports!!

Second - Gary clearly states that he's not interested in the Soaring Council unless it's backed by the City:

I would only be interested in continuing service on a soaring council if it had teeth with the City. I'm confident my father feels the same. In fact I doubt my father would be interested in continuing service given what Jebb has become.

This would become a pattern with Gary, and it took me from December of 2006 until April of 2007 to get the Soaring Council meeting again.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Restart the Council ... the City will Follow

I responded to Gary the next day (December 14th, 2006):

Hello Gary,

Thanks again for your help. The full-scale sailplanes sound like fun, and I hope you can get that going. Let me know if I can help.

I agree that the Soaring Council will need teeth to be useful, and that's why my original plan was to go directly to the City to see if they might interpret the "consultation" clause as a "consent" clause. From your father's August 8, 2002 letter:

      "Flight Director/LESSEE will consult with the Torrey Pines Soaring
      Council, which represents all soaring user groups in forming the above
      mentioned rules and regulations" (Recital 4).

I figured that if the City wouldn't grant that interpretation, then there wasn't much ground left to stand on. But I've been convinced by a bunch of folks that it would be better to revive the Soaring Council first and then wait for a test case to come along (a Rosa Parks with wings?).

As for the "Torrey Pines Advisory Board", I have no current information. But I don't think they have any standing with regard to the lease - and that's where the "teeth" live.

Coincidentally, I've been recently helping out with the Minute-Man projects, and just before responding to you I got an email from one of the "Minute-Moms" who concluded her message with these famous lines:

      "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
               -- Edmund Burke

      "I am only one. I can not do everything but I can do something. And because I
      can not do everything, I will not refuse to do the something I can do. What I
      can do, I should do. And what I should do, by the grace of God, I will do.
              -- Edward Everett Hale

They pretty much sum up my attitude. I'm not very confident that we will change anything at Torrey, but I am certain that we can try. And since that's all we can ever do anyway, it must be good enough.

Thanks again,
Bob K.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Jump Starting the Soaring Council back to Life

By that time (mid December, 2006), I began to understand that the Soaring Council hadn't been meeting for a very long time. By Gary's own comments, several of the members had even passed away, so I needed to "jump start" it back to life. I figured the easiest way to get people talking about the Soaring Council again was to simply ask if I could attend the next meeting. On December 14th of 2006 I sent the following message to the President of the Torrey Pines Gulls RC Club with a copy to several other members and observers:

Hello Cliff (cc Gary, Ron, Alan, Parviz, Mike, and others),

I'm writing because I'd like to attend the next meeting of the Torrey Pines Soaring Council. If there are no meetings scheduled, then I'd like to know what can be done to schedule and attend a meeting as soon as practical. I have visited the Torrey Pines Gulls Historic Society page at: http://www.tpghs.org/SoaringCouncil.html which lists representatives from May 17, 2001. Please let me know if there is a more authoritative (or current) web site for the Torrey Pines Soaring Council.

Thanks for your help, and let me apologize for sending this message to anyone not interested in the topic - and for neglecting anyone who might be interested as well. Please send me any feedback helpful in minimizing future apologies.

Thanks again,
Bob Kuczewski

Gary Fogel responded a few hours later on December 14th, 2006:

Bob,

I can confirm that there is no more authoritative (or current) web site for the Torrey Pines Soaring Council than http://www.tpghs.org.

I have been paying the URL renewal fee for the last N years out of pocket.

Gary

That was pretty much what I expected, but I wanted to make it official. I replied privately to Gary that same day:

Hello Gary,

Thanks for your reply, and I hope you're not offended by my inquiry. I'm just trying to go through the "official" process of getting the ball rolling, and sometimes that requires asking questions with known (or at least suspected) answers.

Thanks again,
Bob K.

I also responded publicly to Gary's message within a few minutes to show my appreciation and offer some support:

Hello Gary (and others),

Thanks for helping me with that part of the puzzle. As I've mentioned in various conversations (to various people), I'd like to see the Soaring Council regain its intended role in making Torrey Pines an enjoyable place for pilots of all wings.

Thanks also for maintaining the TPGHS domain name for all these years. It's a treasure of information, and I would be happy (and honored) to offer my limited HTML coding skills to update it under your direction.

Bob Kuczewski

[Bob Kuczewski]

Volunteering with the AGCSC

I continued to check the Gulls web site for signs of life regarding the Soaring Council and I came across this notice posted by Gary Fogel:

http://www.torreypinesgulls.org/What'sNew.htm#FullScale2007

Thanks largely to the efforts of Ed Slater, it is looking more and more possible that the Associated Glider Clubs of Southern California (AGCSC) will be operating at Torrey Pines in early 2007. Tentative dates have been set for Jan 29-Apr 30 excluding Mar 25-Apr 8 (UCSD spring break). Its likely that serious operations will not begin until mid-February and occur only in strong wind conditions or on weekends when there is sufficient staffing for ground safety. Over the period of the last year, AGCSC has fully renovated their historic winch (dating back to WWII) to include spectra line instead of the old steel cable. Higher launches and longer flights are now the result. Please remember to observe all rules when full scale sailplanes are in operation, especially avoiding being in the bowl for their downwind final approach. Any volunteers interested in helping the AGCSC continue this Torrey tradition should contact Ed Slater at <Edward.Slater@sdcounty.ca.gov>.

In addition, the annual Torrey Pines Buick Invitational Golf Tournament will take place January 22-28, 2007. Be aware of large crowds on the weekend of Jan 27-28 when Tiger Woods will defend his title.

Gary Fogel

That sounded like a great opportunity to get to know some of the sailplane folks so I wrote back to volunteer my time on January 14th, 2007 (exactly 5 years before the date of this post):

Hello Ed (cc Gary),

I read the notice requesting volunteers (included below) on the Torrey Pines Gulls web site. I have no full-scale glider experience, but I do have a private pilots license from 1979 (single engine land and sea) and a B.S. in Aeronautical and Astronautical Engineering (U.W. 1983). I also hold advanced hang gliding and paragliding ratings (USHGA/USHPA) along with some fledgling experience flying RC gliders (much thanks to the Torrey Pines Gulls). I can't guarantee when I might be available, but I'd be happy to be on the notification list for volunteers to help out with your flight operations. I'd also be eager to get any air time in a full-scale glider - if there are any empty seats available.

Sincerely,
Bob Kuczewski
858-204-7499

[Bob Kuczewski]

Behind the Scenes in the AMA

I wasn't sure if my "Jump Starting" was having any effect back in December of 2006 or January of 2007. But behind the scenes, things were happening. On January 9th of 2007, Larry Fogel sent the following message to Rich Hanson of the Academy of Model Aeronautics (the other AMA). Larry wrote:

Subject: Torrey Pines Soaring Council

Dear Rich,

I hope all is well. As you know I have served the AMA as its representative to the Torrey Pines Soaring Council since its inception in 1978. I did this to the best of my ability.

The time has come to have someone else represent AMA in this capacity. The Torrey Pines Soaring Council is currently in a stalemate situation with David Jebb, and although RCers are still active at the site, someone with a proper vision of the aeromodeling history at this site should take my place. My son Gary is a natural fit for this, but he is already serving the Soaring Council as representative for the Soaring Society of America, helping to ensure that the full scale sailplanes have a future here. Thus, my next recommendation would be to have Joe Holtzman serve in this capacity. I believe you know Joe, he is a modeler here in southern California and has been quite aware of the unusually difficult politics at this site.

His address is:

Joe Holtzman
[address deleted]
(949) 859-1223
joeholtzman@cox.net

I would appreciate if you could send a letter nominating him officially for this position and also copying myself and the current President of the Torrey Pines Gulls, Cliff Hunter at cfhunter@hughes.net.

I may be able to visit you in Ontario this Saturday at the AMA convention but in the event I am unable to make it, I hope you have a great time and I'm happy to answer any questions you might have about this decision.

Sincerely,
Larry Fogel

Rich Hanson replied on January 29th, 2007:

Hi Larry,

I didn't run into you at the Convention so I assume you weren't able to make it; however, if you were there, I'm sorry I missed you. In any case, I hope you are doing well.

Attached is a draft letter appointing Joe as your replacement on the Soaring Council. Would you mind taking a look at it just to give it a final proof?

Also, if you'll let me know who to address this to and to what address, I'll mail off a signed copy.

Take care,
Rich Hanson

[Bob Kuczewski]

Keep the Ball Rolling

Once I knew that Joe Holtzman was the newly appointed representative for the AMA, I finally had someone I could officially ask about attending the next Soaring Council meeting - my way of causing such a meeting to happen. So I wrote to Joe Holtzman with a copy to others (Larry and Gary Fogel and a few Gulls members) on February 15th of 2007:

Hello Mr. Holtzman (cc interested club members and others),

I am a relatively new member of the Torrey Pines Gulls, and I am also a hang glider and paraglider pilot (with advanced ratings in both sports). I sent a message to club president Cliff Hunter (and others) on December 14th asking to attend the next meeting of the Torrey Pines Soaring Council. I haven't received a direct response yet, but I did get word that you've been nominated to the AMA position on that council. Could you please let me know what I can do to attend the next meeting and when/where it will be held.

Thank you,
Bob Kuczewski