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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Fri Aug 22, 2014 11:53 pm

evolution


There's a hell of a lot more to it than that.
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Mon Aug 25, 2014 12:58 pm

18 HG pilots died in the USA in 1987


This includes one pilot who landed safely but was likely eaten by a bear.

I have listed fatalities where pilots or soaring parachutists have unhooked and fallen to their deaths from trees. I have even included a few fatalities where pilots or soaring parachutists have crashed with minor injuries, then fallen off cliffs. But unhooking, running for your life, then being caught and eaten by a bear does not seem to be a hang gliding accident to me, so I have revised the number down to 17 US HG fatalities for 1987.

So the fatality figures are a little better than we thought, but only bearly.
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Bill Cummings » Mon Aug 25, 2014 5:20 pm

Rick I was told that an aging HG pilot in California with failing health flew his glider out over the ocean and wanged it all the way down to the water to drown.

Do you recall that report?

Also I remember reading a story where a pilot landed in a lake far from shore and after swimming short of a mile toward shore went under and also drown.
Both would have been maybe 20 to 25 or more years back.

Was the bear story about the Missoula Montana HG pilot that had his parachute laid out to be seen from the air but was never found?
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Tue Aug 26, 2014 12:22 pm

RickMasters wrote:So the fatality figures are a little better than we thought, but only bearly.

:srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl: :srofl:
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Tue Aug 26, 2014 2:38 pm

Was the bear story about the Missoula Montana HG pilot that had his parachute laid out to be seen from the air but was never found?


That doesn't sound familiar. Sometimes rumors get twisted. This pilot got blown over the back of the range into Glacier National Park. He appears to have made a perfect landing in a small clearing but left everything that could have helped him survive. He didn't throw or seem to have had time to lay out his parachute. To me, the only thing that would cause him to flee into what the sheriff described as the impenetrable thicket surrounding the clearing would be bears. Two hikers had been killed by bears within a 40 mile radius within a few weeks of the incident.

I don't have any reports of soaring parachutists being eaten by bears which may indicate bears like their chicken crunchy.
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Tue Aug 26, 2014 3:02 pm

...a pilot landed in a lake far from shore and after swimming short of a mile toward shore went under...


So many reports like that throughout the history of HG and PG, but the numbers are especially high with soaring parachutists who become entangled in a "net" of their own making or get trapped upside down with the air bag floating on top. Sometimes they know what might happen and release in the air -- but often so high that the impact with the water knocks them out and they drown, anyway. Hang gliders are much safer to ditch, it seems, as long as you can unhook underwater. (Pilots should practice that.) But paragliders in the water are so dangerous that many, many rescues over the years have been aborted because the risk to the rescuers of becoming entangled was so high that they just left the poor guy in the water all wrapped up. I have yet to hear of that happening to a hang glider pilot. It's another thing to consider when choosing between full-time aircraft like hang gliders and collapsible garbage like parachutes.
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Wed Aug 27, 2014 10:19 am

I have just learned that the second body of the two soaring parachutists killed in the Russian PG Championships has been found two-and-a-half weeks after the event. The field was caught in the air in a gust front measured at 75 mph by one participant.

I doubt that a hang glider could survive a landing in such conditions but I have outrun violent gust fronts flying fast double-surface gliders on several occasions and landed ahead of them in lighter winds. Paragliders do not appear to have that option.
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Bill Cummings » Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:15 pm

Rick,
Found these. One was 2012
http://fox13now.com/2012/05/14/man-inju ... -accident/
Man injured in hang glider crash near Lehi UT
(Also note the web address says paragliding but 45 mph would be HG)
also
Leon Van Seeters 08/30/2014 tuck tumble at Villa Grove CO.
No deployment, "---impacted rather hard,"
also
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/hangglider-di ... 0aok3.html
"Hang-glider dies after crashing into house" Aug.,31, 2014 Pilot Adam Parer, Newcastle, NSW
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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:34 pm

Image
Thanks Bill. Looks like Adam Parer may have steepened a loop recovery trying to avoid a midair with another HG, lost too much airspeed and stalled. He only needed a few more feet to recover from the subsequent dive but didn't have it. Witness Troy Ravel said,"I was filming him going into a 360 and he looked like he was about to hit another hang-glider. ...it looked like he pulled up to save the collision – and then he went vertical and it looked like the wind got him and it was taking him away from the beach and towards the houses. Then he started flipping over and over again pretty quickly and the bar went out of his hands and as soon as that happened he lost all control, he was free falling essentially. He hit the power line on the way through before he went into the property."

http://www.3news.co.nz/world/witness-au ... 2014090118

This is especially tragic because Adam no doubt had saved countless lives in his career as a firefighter. He is tentatively listed as HG fatality #789 on my list and is the 278th HG fatality since the first paragliding fatality in Europe in the middle 1980s. His death comes on the heels of the 1264th (again, tentative) PG fatality on August 29 in Piedras Blancas, Spain, caused by a canopy collapse at 100 feet.

Here is an example of Adam's skill.

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Re: Rick Masters: Superiority of Hang Gliders

Postby Rick Masters » Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:39 pm

Found these.


Well, it's a thankless task but the Big Picture is important to me, personally. It gives me a slot to place my life in perspective and really understand what I was doing and what my level of risk was in the years I was flying (1978 - 1987). Of course, that was before the truly awesome slaughter of paragliding arrived - but what a comparison! Especially in light of the U$HPGA mantra that they are the about same thing. They are not. One is parachuting. The other is flying aircraft.

I appreciate the effort you and unnamed others (PM) took and it's easy to check these against my database in case I missed one. Neither of the injuries you mentioned have been entered because I don't know enough yet. I realized in forming the list that I had to draw a line on reporting injuries. Ankle, wrist, upper and lower arm and lower leg fractures and dislocations are common to both paragliding and hang gliding but these don't make it to the list unless they are multiple and serious. Thigh fractures do. Do you realize how much force it takes to fracture the femur? It's brutal - but rarely seen in hang gliding. Back injuries always make the list. Likewise head and neck, pelvic and internal. Multiple rib fractures, punctured lungs, etc. Unfortunately, details are often not reported so we end up with an underestimate.

Throughout my flying career, I was terrified of breaking my back and ending up in a wheelchair. Hang gliding was the most dangerous sport. There was very little else to compare it to. But when we crashed our hang gliders, the structure (the airframe) absorbed much of the blow. We were always wrecking our gliders and fixing them. We were always hitting the ground at an angle - rarely falling straight down. Our gliders were never slinging us like a dope on a rope into the ground, for God's sake. We were always centered. For us, angular momentum seemed to play a very small role in hang glider crashes. But the opposite is true with paragliders. In a lot of them, you are falling straight down and slam into the ground with enough force to almost kill you, but not quite - due to the drag of the collapsed parachute. Or when the paraglider goes crazy, you can be pendulumed into the ground. The injuries are truly horrible and more often terminal than in hang gliding.

For perspective, you must understand that my background was exclusively cross county in the stretch of years where hang gliding went from 35 miles to over 200. (I flew Torrey once on a "good" day and got really bored.) XC hang glider pilots, with their boots and survival gear, seem to me to be akin with professional NASCAR drivers compared with the ridiculous, uninspiring and vastly less prepared yahoos who seem to represent the majority of paraglider pilots. Because of the Paraglider Dead Man's Curve, for a paraglider pilot to rise to the same standard of survivability and competence as an XC hang glider pilot, he would have to equip himself with a ballistic chute (for the PDMC) plus all the other gear. You don't see this at all. Instead, you see aerobatic paraglider pilots occasionally with two or even three chutes while many others "brave" the PDMC in Spandex. They seem to have no concept of the risk. It's a bravado thing. And when the inevitable happens, normal atmospheric turbulence becomes "a freak gust of wind."

Parapeople, get out of the sky. You don't belong there.
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