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Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:10 pm
by Bob Kuczewski
Hi Sam and the Southwest Texas Hang Gliders,

I was just browsing the Crestline forum ( when I found a fellow selling a scooter tow rig:

IMG_0552s.jpg (203.48 KiB) Viewed 9108 times

I don't know if you're looking for anything to put in that hangar, but here are some descriptions from the fellow selling it if you're interested:


Submitted by Rando on Fri, 01/17/2014 - 10:53

Designed and built by Brian Dahl.

Includes 1984 street legal Yamaha 180Z scooter.

4,000 foot Spectra line on drum that replaces rear wheel via 3 lugnuts.

Welded steel line guide.

Location: Dana Point, Ca.

Call Randy


Sorry, I have no pics.

It's 3 separate pieces: The scooter. The line guide. The Spectra reel. No trailer.

The scooter is just a bit over six feet and fits in the back of even a small pickup at a diagonal

The line guide stakes to the ground in front of the scooter, and the scooter needs to be tied to something so it doesn't get pulled towards the glider.

I am moving and don't have any time to stop to do anything else, so no demo day. Sorry again.

If anyone knows how to get ahold of Brian Dahl (designer/builder) or Monte Bell,(the guy I bought it from) you could find out more than I know about it. I used it only once. 2 tows, worked well.

Monte said he would buy it back from me if I ever wanted to get rid of it, but I don't know where he is.

I paid $1500 for it. The concensus was that it was a really good deal.

Also, to be honest, I talked to someone about the reel size and he felt that it probably doesn't really have 4k feet of spectra I was told

Even if that's true, it's still a screaming deal.

The glass is out of the left rear view mirror, and the gas cap is missing, and it needs a new battery. It was like that when I bought it.

I just did a quick search to see if I could find any pics. Didn't find any.

I found a few referrences. One of them mentioned a pulley out some distance from the scooter.

That is not the case with this one. The line guide is immediately in front of the scooter and the stakes need to be put in at an angle so it does't lift when the line angle gets steep.

Hope that helps a bit.

Hey SmokeJoe,

It's a turnkey scooter tow.

5 minute setup and you're towing.

Needs a jumpstart.if you dont want to buy a battery

If you want to drive it on the street, you would need to cut a new mirror glass, or buy a new mirror.

Takes 15 seconds to install.

Gas cap same thing.

very small project.

Make it $450 and you got a deal.


The outside layer is tan. Maybe 150 feet. Not frayed

Under looks pure white.

I remember there being several single knots (not tied together)

I didn't try to undo them.

Thought maybe thats not good to undo and why they weren't removed already.

Just got offerd $500 to deliver. Will see if I can get away for a couple of hours to do it.


Ok, the $500 delivered backed out. I think he said wife wouldn't let him. Can't remember. Too much stuff in my life.

Anyway, I started it up today. Had a hard time. Googled it. Turned out it was because the side kickstand had to be up, and the brake had to be pressed to start. I totally forgot that. Ha.

Started right up. Runs GOOD. Carb float stuck . Tapped on it with a hammer handle and it mostly stopped the overflow. However, it still drips 2 drops per second while running (but doesn't flood out). Stops dripping when not running. May get better, may not. It may need to be taken apart to clean the needle.

I don't have time to do that, Will take best offer (If there is one).

This thing really is slick. I would REALLY hate to throw it away(see below).The Variator transmission is amazingly powerful, and the inginuity of the way the feed comes out the front without interferrence is way cool. I just wish that I didn't have to get rid of it (even though I haven't used it forever) go figure.

BTW: I talked to Brian Dahl. He said that he didn't make this one, and that he had always tried to figure out how to do the "out the front" feed efficiently. Brian said that Marcello (DeBarros: AKA Atmosphere PG) had a couple of his builds at one time, and that they had discussed modifiing one, but didn't know of any such critter in existence.

Marcello is in Brazil right now, and I haven't tried to contact him.

If anyone cares, I think he gets email there. Maybe find out if this thing is as great as I think it is.

Bottom line: I don't have a place to put it and I gotta go. I have it in a friends garage but don't feel good about imposing.

I will keep it until next weekend

I won't want to hear "Don't throw it away, I'll take it".

SmokinJoe, Still interested? $300

Thanks guys,


Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:34 am
by SamKellner

Thanks for posting the scooter. :clap:

It looks like a good deal. Usually it costs $500 to get the rear wheel converted to a spool, so in this case you get the scooter and spectra FREE.

The line guide looks useless. Mounting on a small trailer would be easy.

Sounds like a good deal. You should buy this and tow up HG on the UCSD strip at Torrey. ;)


Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:36 am
by Bob Kuczewski
That's an interesting idea Sam!!!

I was originally thinking about the scooter for your club, but if we could get UCSD to allow us to use their strip, that would really change the landscape here at Torrey.

By the way, how do you like the forum new banner? Should we keep this one or go back to the earlier version?   :thumbup:    or    :thumbdown: ?

Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:15 pm
by SamKellner

Hey, even in calm to 10mph, you could get high enough to do top landing approach.

The concept seems doable. This scooter might be under powered for Torrey use.

If the scooter is as good as the guy says it is, it sounds like a great deal for $300 :shock: even $500 :thumbup:

The forum logo looks fine. Let's leave it a while. :thumbup:

Thanks for your help Bob.


Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:26 pm
by Bill Cummings
Sam, I’m trying to remember but isn’t a 250 cc motor on a scooter tow closer to the middle of the power envelope for HG?

Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 6:04 am
by SamKellner

Yep, the 180cc is as small as I would want. That might be too small to max out the Torrey area.

Steve Wendt at BlueSky strongly promotes 50cc rigs for first day agenda. They are really limited.

I am very satisfied with our 250cc.

Can hardly wait to get the hangar mods complete so we can keep the scooter, and gliders, up there and get a lot more use out of it.

I are working on that and making good progress.

Tow at Torrey :idea:


Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:40 pm
by Bill Cummings
I was initially against the idea of teaching beginning pilots with scooter tow until I
watched Ed Bennett teach with one. I even hooked myself to his rig with the stipulation
that I use my Skyting Bridle and my own weaklink.
If done low and slow I have to admit that it can be done safely.
Of course advancing too soon could get a pilot out of low and slow.

Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 6:17 pm
by SamKellner
Hi BillC,

Low and slow scooter towing is a great way to start beginners.

I use the Skyting bridle. I helps with beginners

With the 250cc, I can pull tandem PG also, at ~ 2/3 throttle.

When did you try scooter towing?


Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 9:52 pm
by Bill Cummings
I'd have to check the log book. It has to be around 2004 at the Dry LZ with Ed Bennett.

Re: Scooter Tow for Sale in California

PostPosted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 7:19 pm
by Bill Cummings
Rick M:

It would also be interesting to see how many people might be enticed to try basic Low-and Slow low-impact hang gliding with the Hawks if we make it as easy as possible

Hi Rick,

Been doing this for several years now.

But I'm wondering. The term "Low and Slow" hang gliding, also around for years, is in reference to beginner scooter towing.

Are we on the same page?

I'm on your page Sam.
On the training hill even if you back up it slowly with each run, at some point, pilots will get off to the left or right as they fly down. If they do a complete 180 turn the slope is there to stop them abruptly. If the same thing happens on the flat while scooter towing you have a chance that the wheels will save the pilot and equipment.
On the flat is less tiring than climbing the hill so more runs can be completed on the flat than on the hill.
Many times the scooter can be moved to accommodate the wind direction. Not as easy to adjust the hill's direction.
If at the beginning of the run a tip drops getting the glider stopped on the flat is not hard to do. Stopping on a hill is not as easy.
Wheels have a greater range of assistance on the flat. On a hill they usually only help (but too much) coming down.
Wheels on the side of a hill make waiting tiring.
On tow you can reduce the throttle to end the ground skimming flight. On the hill the gravity throttle, so far, has been resistant to adjustment.
Low with slow progression using scooter tow is easier for us old guys than the hill. At age 68 and using a hill about all I can do is work the 2 meter radio.
Not quite sure what I think about this towing video