[JoeF]

Nice share, Doug! Payload: 600 lb on 35 lb wing. Such clues us to some satisfying futures for low-mass wings for 180 lb payload for moderate conservative glides.

Project note: Five tote nests. In the main tube nests could be some ribs.

====================================================
Following filler holding my prompts regards a broad view of dynamic soaring "kite systems" while presently noting that a hang glider belongs in the same family. A Moment With ChatGPT

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[dhmartens]

So just to follow up on an informal non ai basis the 12 foot wing easily broken down to 6 foot, channeling the power from the axel to a prop with a gear. This device compared to California high speed rail, we could buy every resident a flying motorcycle that packs down to 6 feet.

[dhmartens]

using paid grok on behalf of bobk: Concise mission statement in Bob Kuczewski’s voice:“We need the flying motorcycle because personal flight belongs to pilots, not bureaucracies. A simple geared-prop hang-glider bike puts real, low-cost freedom back in the hands of ordinary people—exactly what recreational hang gliding was meant to be—while billion-dollar high-speed rail and over-regulated commercial sites keep locking the sky behind money, rules, and self-serving safety claims. Build it, fly it, and keep the air free.”

[JoeF]

One UPHG will frame assemble mostly flat until posting subassembly raises the planar frame subassembly, followed by frame locking by connecting the lower ends of the two queen posts to their respective rigging stations. Then the tensegrity frame will be heart wrapped and sail dressed.

[dhmartens]

So we have competition with paragliders so we must ramp it up.










every hang glider including the 12 foot Bob Wills can be broken down to 6 feet.

[dhmartens]

I have never been more blocked so heer is the contenhttps://live.staticflickr.com/655 ... 60120.jpgt after 39 attempts:
\

[Bob Kuczewski]

using paid grok on behalf of bobk: Concise mission statement in Bob Kuczewski’s voice:“We need the flying motorcycle because personal flight belongs to pilots, not bureaucracies. A simple geared-prop hang-glider bike puts real, low-cost freedom back in the hands of ordinary people—exactly what recreational hang gliding was meant to be—while billion-dollar high-speed rail and over-regulated commercial sites keep locking the sky behind money, rules, and self-serving safety claims. Build it, fly it, and keep the air free.”

Please don't quote me saying anything that I didn't say.
Please don't use any tools (AI or otherwise) to duplicate my voice or image in any way.

Thanks.

[dhmartens]

“An earlier AI-generated text that was presented as reflecting Bob Kuczewski’s views or voice was not written or authorized by him. It should not be treated as his statement. Bob has asked that no one quote him as saying things he did not say and that AI not be used to imitate his voice. I respect that request and retract any implication that the text came from him.”

I got over excited at the possibilty of a new sport, much like speed gliding:

An AI-generated text was previously created in response to a prompt exploring ideas around portable (5-ft-pack) hang gliders, possible motorcycle-style powered concepts, and comparisons to the large cost overruns of California’s high-speed rail project. That text was framed and shared in a way that presented it as reflecting Bob Kuczewski’s voice or views. Bob later posted objecting to being quoted as saying things he did not say and to any use of AI (or other tools) to duplicate his voice. The generated text was not written or authorized by him.

Synergy between a true 5-foot-pack hang glider and a motorcycleA hang glider that packs down to a maximum dimension of about 5 feet (roughly the length of a standard motorcycle luggage rack or the space beside a rider) removes the biggest practical barrier that has historically favored paragliding: portability.Core synergyTransport simplicity
Modern hang gliders usually pack to 12–18 feet and require a roof rack, trailer, or large vehicle. A genuine 5-foot pack fits on or beside almost any motorcycle (or in a car trunk, bus, train, or small aircraft). The motorcycle becomes both the launch-site access vehicle and the retrieval vehicle. One person can ride to a remote ridge, set up, fly, pack, and ride home without depending on chase crews or large parking areas.
Site access expansion
Many excellent soaring sites are closed or restricted because of vehicle size, parking limits, or landowner concerns about “big glider” traffic. A motorcycle + 5-ft pack combination can reach trailheads, forest roads, or coastal bluffs that are impractical for conventional hang-glider transport. This multiplies the number of usable flying days and locations for hang-glider pilots.
Setup and logistics speed
While a 5-ft pack still requires more assembly time than a paraglider, the overall door-to-launch time can become competitive when the transport phase is dramatically shortened. The motorcycle also provides a ready means of quick retrieval after a cross-country flight, reducing the classic hang-gliding “long walk or hitch-hike” problem.

Potential competitive effect relative to paragliding Paragliding’s main advantages have been lighter weight, faster packing, and easier transport. A reliable 5-foot-pack hang glider directly attacks those advantages while retaining hang gliding’s inherent performance edges:Higher glide ratios and better penetration into wind
Superior speed range
More precise pitch control and generally higher structural rigidity

If the pack size drops to motorcycle-friendly dimensions without sacrificing too much performance or setup convenience, hang gliding can reclaim pilots and sites that currently default to paragliders purely for logistical reasons. The sport becomes more accessible to people who do not own large vehicles, live in cities, or travel frequently.Realistic limitsEngineering trade-offs remain: more joints mean potential weight, complexity, and setup time penalties.
Regulatory and safety questions (powered assist versions, road-legal combinations, airspace rules) would still need addressing.
Paragliding will keep advantages in pure foot-launch weight and “stuff-in-a-backpack” convenience for pure hiking approaches.

The synergy is therefore logistical rather than purely aerodynamic: the motorcycle solves the transport bottleneck that has limited hang gliding’s growth, while the 5-foot pack makes that solution practical. In areas where vehicle access and packing size currently tip the balance toward paragliding, this combination can shift the practical equation back toward hang gliding.

[dhmartens]

Alright Bobk and Ushpa. I will inform you, We are being destroyed. https://rapzilla.com/2018-09-tim-trudea ... -business/

Tim Trudeau is going to desroy me, you and hang gliding as we know it and there is nothing you, me, San Diego, Karen Bass. Gavin Newsome or Brad Sherman can do about it. We are done. I am formally declassifiying it under current whistle blower forgiveness. I am sorry I with held it so long. I had scallops and organic bacon for luch so I am ot as effected as You will all be.

[dhmartens]

I am being attacked by https://www.saul.com/professionals/mark-mizrahi and he charged $1,500 per hour, where is Larry Chambly when you need him most.

Luckilly Gemini ai has cooperated fully with this thread, so here is highly guided ai content:
1st prototype


refined prototype


gemini generated:
Subject:
The ultimate "bike-to-fly" setup? Short-packed Falcon 4 + integrated power conceptHey everyone,I wanted to share a visual design concept exploring just how portable personal flight can become when you utilize short-packing.The idea here is a complete, self-contained transport and flight system built around a 5-foot/6-foot short-packed Wills Wing Falcon 4 and a minimalistic pod harness (inspired by the Mosquito NRG). Instead of needing a massive truck or roof racks, everything is engineered to mount onto a Honda CR-250 dirt bike for easy trail or highway access to remote launch sites.Key Design Features:Custom Low-Profile Side Rack: Safely supports the short-packed Falcon 4 package alongside the frame without throwing off the rider's center of gravity or steering clearance.Integrated Power Take-Off (PTO) System: To eliminate the dead weight of carrying a completely separate engine for the harness, the bike's own CR-250 powerplant serves dual duty. A mechanical power-take-off shaft links directly from a sprocket on the rear axle area up to a bevel-gear drive assembly mounted on the harness framework.Dual-Purpose Engine: Once you arrive at the flying site, you can decouple the drive linkage or use the bike's transmission to run the prop directly for powered flight or testing right from the rig, maximizing utility while minimizing extra equipment weight.Curious to hear the community's thoughts on the mechanical feasibility of the rear-axle PTO linkage, weight distribution, or if anyone else has experimented with driving a harness prop directly off a motorcycle powerplant!