[jcoyier]

Several year back I bought a new, single surface glider (Icaro RX2) and a new harness (WW cocoon). Previously I had flown a vintage pod harness WWZ3) with a vintage double surface glider (UP Comet). I'm a relatively low time recreational pilot and am finding it difficult to launch in the cocoon harness. Several things have happened I thought I'd share for others trying to do the same thing. The very first difference that really hit me was having this bulky half-harness right in front of my legs during the launch run. I asked around and the first piece of advice I got was to just tie a cord to the boot with a loop in it. Catch the loop with your thumb and release once in the air. I did this but had my thumb a bit too far into the loop and as I left the ground found it impossible to release the cord without taking that hand off the control bar.....something you normally don't want to be doing just after getting airborne. With that cord hooked onto my thumb and the cord hooked to the harness boot I found myself diving dramatically. It took several seconds for me to come to the conclusion that if I didn't let go of the control bar I would indeed crash in a steep dive. Lucky for me this launch was steep enough for me to let go of the control bar, drop the loop off my thumb and pull out before I hit the trees below me. The second thing I found was how easy it was to step through the rear left suspension line leaving my left leg outside of the harness boot. I even had an experienced pilot give me a hang check and that pilot completely missed this. This has happened repeatedly even when I think I'm really paying attention to it (obviously not enough!). This happens REALLY easily after hooking in and then backing into the control frame to pick up the glider. My stock WW harness leg loops are not adjustable allowing me to really slip way down in the harness as I leave the ground making getting into the boot a real challenge. With the left leg now outside of the harness AND my body position very low in the harness, getting my leg back inside the harness is fairly difficult although I have yet to not get it back inside with some effort. To make this easier (I've allowed this to happen several times) I let go of the control frame and pull the harness down scooting my body forward in the harness and then pull that leg back in. Needless to say this is really distracting and I usually wait until I'm out away from the hill to even attempt it. The third thing I've been struggling with is how to get a good launch run in. Compared to a pod, the cocoon is a real challenge where a strong launch run is required. I've seen several methods used and have tried them all. None have left me feeling I could really get a strong, controlled launch. I've been off slope launches, cliff launches and ramp launches however none have been very demanding (light conditions, shallow slope, etc.) The methods I've tried include a) clipping the boot to the stock clip point on the right side of my harness and folding the boot back which puts the boot off to the right side of my legs, b) letting the boot drag free between my legs, c) folding the boot forward up in front of my thighs and using the side clip. With all three of these methods I have tried them either leaving the storage pockets empty or filling them with my glider bag and gear. For the first method, you then need to “unclip” once flying which is a challenge even without gloves. With gloves I think it would be impossible. For the second method, my launch run amounts to a fast waddle which makes entry into the boot the easiest for me but really does not allow for a strong running launch. I tried the third method once and discovered immediately that there is no way to push the boot back once you have weighted the harness. I flew that one all the way to the LZ with my legs sticking out of the back of the harness (got a good launch run in though). If the conditions are not especially challenging, I presently prefer letting the boot drag between my legs as this seems to allow me relatively easy entry into the harness post-launch but it makes for a very hindered run. If you have experience with a cocoon harness and can relate to what I've run into, I'd like to hear any suggestions you might have as to things that are working for you. Oh, there are some things I left out......the cocoon is REALLY nice to land with. Getting upright is very easy compared to the WW Z3 pod I had prior plus you never need to worry about a stuck zipper. It is also much more comfortable in the air and makes flying hot conditions much more enjoyable.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Hi John,

Firstly, thanks for posting!! It's been a while, and it's great to hear from you!!!   

Secondly, I agree with your reasons for liking the cocoon harness as well as your concerns about the boot. I have flown with the cocoon harness pictured below since about 2004 or 2005 (you've probably seen me flying with it at Funston). I love it.

I have a system that I like, but it does have a few drawbacks. Please use your own good judgement before trying it or adopting it.

First, here's my harness both in the bag and stretched out:

harness_boot_line_step0.jpg (125.7 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

harness_boot_line_step1.jpg (79.42 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

There's a little loop on the right shoulder where I've added a shoulder ring:

harness_boot_line_step2.jpg (86.57 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

This lets me run a line (tied to the boot) through the ring, then through a snap hook, and then tied back to the shoulder ring:

harness_boot_line_step3.jpg (98.93 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

When flying prone with the harness stretched out, the hook just hangs there at my shoulder and the line to the boot is stretched to full length. But when I need to pull up the boot (launch or landing), I can extend the hook and it pulls up the boot at a 2 to 1 ratio so I can clip it back to the boot:

harness_boot_line_step4.jpg (84.09 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

In other words, the original line is now 3 lines cutting the distance by a third. That's enough to keep the boot from being stepped on during launch or landing.

If I wanted to get the boot even higher, I could pass the hook through the boot loop and fasten it back to the shoulder ring:

harness_boot_line_step5.jpg (113.82 KiB) Viewed 1929 times

I don't think I've ever done that in flight, but it should be possible. More often (at least on launch), I clip the boot into the hook and clip that to my shoulder ring (not shown here). That keeps the boot as high as possible for the launch run (just as it would be without my retrieval line system).

Here's a picture of me launching at Torrey (from John Heiney's Demo Reel) with the boot clipped all the way up:

Using this method leaves both of my hands 100% available for doing the important work of launching and landing. I don't have to be thinking about which finger is holding my boot string and when I'm going to release it. Here's the video of my launch at Torrey (about 10 seconds into the video):

https://youtu.be/TUDtzSBgyMo

The most important thing to remember is ALWAYS FLY THE GLIDER FIRST. I've seen pilots get in trouble messing with their harness on launch or landing, and it's a very dangerous thing to do. That's why I don't like holding the boot in my fingers ... it's just one more thing to get in the way at the most critical moment of your entire flight. As you can tell from my (many) Dockweiler videos, I have accumulated lots of air time in the upright position with no boot at all. You can fly fairly well in that configuration, so there's no rush to go prone immediately after launch. You can even fly from the base tube in the upright position if you need to do so. Get safely away from the hill with PLENTY of room, and then take a look at dropping the boot.

Those are my personal views. Please use your own good judgement in adopting them or not.

[DaveSchy]

I flew with 2 consecutive cocoons from Betty at High Energy, at least 30 years. I would simply hook my finger through the harness loop near my knee and pull it aside while doing my grapevine grip on the uprights until clear of launch and ready to go prone. I saw lots of times when people would clip the boot, in some fashion, and then wind up unable to get it unclipped, for whatever reason.
My advice is keeping it simple

[jcoyier]

Thanks for the replies and tips. Here's a video of me launching at a site in WA state (Dog Mtn) this summer. It demonstrates a couple of the issues I'm working through that I described in my post. I'm wondering if either of you have adjustable leg loops? Mine are not and they are HUGE! The only adjustment I have on that stock harness is the chest strap which I cinch up as tight as I can get it but I still slide down significantly as I'm launching. All this is a non-issue at places like Funston where I rarely need to take more than a step to get into the air. It's the launches where I need a good, solid run where I have trouble.

[Bob Kuczewski]

My advice is keeping it simple

That's always good advice!! Anything can go wrong, so the more "things" there are, the more chance of one of them going wrong.

Thanks for the replies and tips. Here's a video of me launching at a site in WA state (Dog Mtn) this summer.
   :
   :
https://youtu.be/baOxZF1M3Js

FYI, here on the U.S. Hawks, you can embed videos right in your post with code that looks like this

    [youtube]49NqifP_pbk[/youtube]

The letters between the "[youtube]" and "[/youtube]" tags are just the video ID part: https://youtu.be/49NqifP_pbk

Here's the result:

The nice thing is that people can easily see your video while reading your post. But it's just a suggestion. The author of a post should make it however they like it.

I'm wondering if either of you have adjustable leg loops?

Yes, mine are adjustable. But they do tend to work loose, so I find myself tightening them at launch. I then loosen them when I'm in the air (for comfort) and tighten them up again prior to landing. I think adjustable leg loops should be the default for a number of reasons.

Regarding the lines dangling, I don't recall ever having that problem. But I don't think I have any video from that angle, so I don't know for sure. From your video, I am surprised at how much line is flopping around. Getting your legs misrouted through them could be a serious problem:

John_with_misrouted_line.jpeg (81.22 KiB) Viewed 1851 times

That's one of the things that I like about clipping the boot to my chest before launch. I can sort out all of the lines and make sure they at least won't interfere with my launch. The "clipped up" configuration also avoids all the "waddling" around with the boot dangling between your legs as seen in your video. But as Dave points out, there are some downsides to the added complexity.

[jcoyier]

Bob,
Interesting that you have no problem getting the harness to fall back once you release it from your chest clip. As I mentioned when I tried folding the harness in front of me like that, once I weighted the harness I couldn't get it to flop back since I was now lying on the fold. It just now occurred to me that I should have tried going upright at that point to see if I could have gotten the boot to flip down and back. My typical launch is to go prone almost immediately after getting into the air because otherwise I feel I'm just allowing my body to slip way down onto those huge, non-adjustable leg straps which makes getting into the boot that much more of a challenge. I'll have to go try this in the shop and see what happens.

[Bob Kuczewski]

I picked up a lot of good tips from Joe Greblo over the years.

One of the ones I remember is him saying that as pilots advance, their skills at flying upright slowly decay. Just like you said, pilots launch and go prone almost immediately. I remember Joe suggesting that pilots should spend some time flying upright just to stay comfortable in that position. I try to do that every once in a while (when I remember).

I also typically stay upright for a fair amount of time after launch and also through my entire landing approach. I believe that you can get much quicker roll response when upright, but I also admit that pitch control can suffer. I've generally felt that immediate roll response was more important at the sites where I've flown. But that depends a lot on the site.

[DaveSchy]

Regarding hanging "monkey" :

After launch, until well clear of obstacles or close traffic.

Within 500 to 300 ft of LZ will increase drag and transfer control to the downtubes, (3/4 monkey is full flaps!). Watching pilot rotation from prone immediately before a flare always makes me think about first aid kits, doing that isn't cool, or styling, it's disrespectful, unless you're in a short landing situation.

The launch video from Dog :
Attempting launch with a floppy boot is asking for problems, tripping, face planting...whereas pulling it aside clears the knees and legs for an aggressive run. Hang check for proper height above base tube... It is possible your chest/belly strap is over tightened.

Lift the glider using the grapevine grip, as you did, until you feel most of the the slack come out of the harness mains AND leg loops (bonus is a final suspension check!). If the leg loops are still too loose, discuss making them tighter with your certified chute rigger.
My thoughts on Dog politics are well documented elsewhere.

In Memory of Gene Matthews passing 15 years ago....

[jcoyier]

I experimented a bit with my harness in the shop last night and found that I can still stand flat-footed on the floor with a hook in point 88" off the floor. I don't think there is any way I can lift the glider so that my hook in is 88" above the ground. This leads me to believe I need to modify the harness and probably start with the leg straps. Making them adjustable seems like the logical thing to do first.

Dave, what effect would you expect an over-tight chest/belly strap to have?

[Bob Kuczewski]

Great comments Dave.     

My thoughts on Dog politics are well documented elsewhere.

Feel free to provide links!!   

This leads me to believe I need to modify the harness and probably start with the leg straps. Making them adjustable seems like the logical thing to do first.

Just be sure there's some mechanism to keep them from coming completely loose!! My harness has the strap ends rolled and sewn to keep from ever sliding out of the adjustment buckle. I've often thought that an additional patch of Velcro would be nice as an additional assurance (and to reduce slipping when walking with the glider).