[Bob Kuczewski]

Here's a draft waiver that I believe was written by Ernie earlier this year.

Thanks for all your hard work Ernie!!


 
 

[JoeF]

Supporting with $30 to extend message to 750 views...
I wonder of those coming views: will any become interested followers ...?
Thanks, Eagle,
Joe

Nov. 9, 2022, I just put in $50 more to reach for more views --1250 views--- of the Petition at Change.org
Not sure if this is all out of date, but because I am still prevented from flying at Torrey,
I urge change to a free and open public park. I do not want to be forced to join a club
or pay a business to use a public park and open and free federal airspace.

Younger days. in 1960... Now 80 trying to catch up to Frank, but he keeps moving his number further on ... whew!
I was jumping into the air here and there and most everywhere; this park, that park, this public space, that public space. No fees.

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Why not walk throughout San Diego with a Little hawk and give a small flyer to all citizens of the City asking them to urge their City to HALT THE PRIVATIZATION OF TORREY PINES recreational hang gliding. Let's write the flyer. It would be excellent exercise for me to walk throughout San Diego.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Why not walk throughout San Diego with a Little hawk and give a small flyer to all citizens of the City asking them to urge their City to HALT THE PRIVATIZATION OF TORREY PINES recreational hang gliding. Let's write the flyer. It would be excellent exercise for me to walk throughout San Diego.

I think that's a great idea Joe. But the current Little Hawk is too big for that. I propose that we build some slightly smaller versions more like the one that Joe Greblo loaned me for the "Kick Gas Festival":

Jay "flying" Joe Greblo's borrowed glider at the 2009 Kick Gas Festival in San Diego in a booth purchased and manned by the Torrey Hawks Hang Gliding Club

Jay_with_Joe_Greblo_Glider_at_Kick_Gas.jpg (65.97 KiB) Viewed 732 times

Even that one might be too big. We probably want something with a 6 to 10 foot wing span (maybe even "busable" ). Let's exchange some ideas and maybe some plans on how to build these. People could do that everywhere from coast to coast. It's another brilliant idea from the mind of Joe Faust!!



P.S. I like this idea so much that I've started a new topic (Brainstorming ideas for "Mini Hawk") to discuss design ideas. Thanks Joe!!!!

[Chris McKeon]

yOU KNOW i HAVE NEVER fLOWN AT tORREY pINES. Most likely I never will. ut reading about how it sounds like as Few People have some how gained Control of a Public stretch oh beach. Then using their ill gotten Power and influence have been able too coerce and influence the local Police to arrest Who They feel are Pilots who have Violated the Rules and Regulations that "THEY HAVE ENACTED" Talk about: "THE TAIL WAGGING THE DOG"! Look I am Hundreds of Miles away, I will Most likely never go Down to san Diego to Fly. But if i did Go down to that stretch of Coast Line to Fly My Predator. If some schmuck walked up to Me and told Me that To Fly here at Torrey Pines, You need to do X. I would say to the Smuck; I will do wat You want so that I can fly off this Cliff after You do One thing for Me. The Smuck would naturally say to Me: What do You want Me to Do? I would say: "GO POUND SOME SALT". I know, I Know. The Schmuck would call in his enforcers, "HIS" friends at the local Police Department to come arrest Me. So to think that Hang Gliding is called {Free|-Flight. Learning about how just a few individuals have been allowed to Manhandle the Many is Quite disturbing.

[Craig Muhonen]

The Schmuck would call in his enforcers, "HIS" friends at the local Police Department to come arrest Me.

That's what I mean Chris, and I rant,
hypothetically we know exactly what they are going to do to any HG pilot who exercises their right, and this has been happening everywhere,
and hypothetically. why not be ready for them and get it all on film with a microphone in their face, and it could be said, " we are private citizen journalists with
US Hawks Hang Gliding Association, asking the hard questions about this waiver you have to sign at a public park", or why some Hang Glider Pilots have been banned from flying, or why true HG and glider and RC pilots don't fly here anymore because it's just too crowded with Paragliders, why can't/won't the city demand that certain days for HG only , and certain days for PG.? They have an flight park advisory council don't they".

I think on very windy days, and you could see it coming, TPGP could be flooded with very colorful (king post) Hang Gliders, some of them tethered flying, and put on an airshow. shouldn't be a problem, paragliders can't fly safely anyway, and you got your film crew and "announcer" with you. They can't arrest us all?

Seeing many Hang Gliders set up in a row is down right inspiring, and they show themselves quite well.

The human Schmucks will show their true selves and if the video went viral well....


.

[Chris McKeon]

Well up here in Northern California, we must deal with our own schmucks. In fact our employes have such a distorted view regarding the Mountain and what their role is yup on the mountain. They refuse to accept reality. They are not up on the Mountain to protect the montasin from Us. We are in fact. I will use a word here that will make our rangers cringe. REALITY. WE the Property owing TAX Paying citizens Who Own the Mountain. They, Park Rangers on the other hand are our employees. They are Public Servant's who have lost track regarding their Role, and Who their Employers are. At this Point and time. How to Fix it I do not have a Clue.

[Craig Muhonen]

The Petition Has hundreds of signatures both electronically and by clipboard.
The numbers could grow at any point. as community signatures come easy for our freedom.

The petition exposes the problem, fills the room with the public's voice. opens the door to discussion and most of all provide's a proven solution that ends the dispute. As a result, without disclosing too much, speaking as Ernie Casco, La Jolla Town Council will be providing a fair letter concerning Gliderport issues to forward to the Mayor and City Council.

As It goes, the Petition is still in progress being shown as a package to inform other districts and community leaders, gaining further endorsements. This all makes a difference where it counts at the City Council where changes are made.

You could pitch in any way you want, with added signatures, letters of support, or show up at the meeting.
Commercialization and Privatization of our park by our own leaders is unacceptable and a disgrace to the sport of freeflight

Golden Eagle.jpg

TY Ernie, this is big

I like your post, "what are you in for"?...
"I went to the beach".

We got drafted right out of high school in Torrance, because, "I went to the beach".
We must have pissed off LBJ by sneaking past his Marine Guard at Trestles and surfing in front of them all day, it was public water and the only third parties were the MP's, then getting by them again when we would finally get out. ..ha ..

1964 graduates had a hard time because we were all conscripted in the first draw and we were all 1A of course because of our surfer bodies, and they were taking all the "Bums" anyway. We thought that we were 4F because no way our bloody surfing knots could get tied into a boot, they laughed
My class had 200 out of 220, get shipped to the Vietnam theater, somehow most of us made it back by 1968, back to the California Coast, for a short time, ahhh...
What year did you graduate?

Petitions (camera crews),and court cases won and documented, will put single pilot HG's back in their rightful place,
where they can "certify" that they are a trained pilot of a hang glider air frame, and stay current.
BRAVO

From HG.org (?name)

"PiG"

"HuG"

.

[Bob Kuczewski]

I have been having an ongoing discussion with Eagle about his petition, and I just wanted to copy what I found at the "moveon.org" version here:

    https://sign.moveon.org/petitions/black-s-beach-recreational-scandal

To: City Council, La Jolla Town Council, the Public and Law enforcement
Black's Beach Recreational Scandal "STOP Commercialization and privatization of SD Parks"
Campaign created by
Ernie Casco

TPGP.jpg (39.47 KiB) Viewed 249 times

Black's Beach Recreational Scandal
Stop Commercialization and Privatization of San Diego Public Parks
Stop Gliderport forced access fees to use our free park (illegal fees.)
Stop Insurance fees (not required by law.)
Stop fees going to Private Business to use any San Diego parks now.

Endorse a recreational public waver, Including permanent Gliderport operation oversight as needed for public conflict and safety. Support public use of public land without requiring private membership in any private club or abusive private waivers. California Recreational Statutes Law,
protects the owner of land from lawsuits due to injury. Any additional insurance requirements, is a scam using public land to enrich private Pockets.

According to one member of La Jolla Town Council.
"Commercialization and privatization of San Diego Parks is unacceptable"

Should a private company be able to charge us to use our own publicly-owned Beach? No. Should private companies be able to control who can use our public publicly owned city parks? No.

Yet that is exactly what's happening at the Torrey Pines Gliderport. The current San Diego Mayor and City Council have allowed a private business to completely control who can use our public park land and what price must be paid. This is a precedent that must be reversed or all of our public parks and beaches will become profit centers for private businesses squatting on our public land.

That's the line that must be drawn clearly and decisively at Torrey Pines Gliderport before the disease of commercialization spreads to Blacks Beach, to La Jolla Shores, to the Cove, and to all of our public land.

I hereby demand that all public beaches and parks shall ALWAYS be free and accessible to all citizens without requiring payments of any kind to or allowing control by any third party business.

Why is this important?

Hello Friends of our public
We would like to see a discussion of the Torrey Pines Gliderport (which is owned by the City of San Diego) be added to the agenda for the next LJ Town Council meeting. We have been requesting this for many months and have been given many excuses in return.

The Torrey Pines Gliderport is city land that has been leased - for FREE - to a private FOR PROFIT business since 1998. It was originally a 5 year lease with an option to be extended for ONE additional 5 year term. So it expired in 2008 and yet continues to this day.

In about 2006, the City was sued for the many abuses of the Gliderport business, and the City settled the lawsuit in the complainant's favor and agreed to create a Torrey Pines City Park Advisory Board containing all interested stakeholders. The City (Mayor Sanders) created the "Board" under the wrong section of the City Charter (43b rather than 43a - look it up), and that enabled the City to both limit and terminate the Board to keep it from correcting the ongoing problems and abuses. To this day there is no oversight by the City and the business brings in millions of dollars every year without a dime going to the City itself.

The Torrey Pines Gliderport is a poster child for the corruption in San Diego, We want the La Jolla Town Council to investigate and address the Issue with the City Council to fix it. (Closure)

We have the 1998 lease agreement which I believe is still in effect to this day. Feel free to verify that this lease is current with the City's Real Estate Assets Division.

Thank You
I also welcome anyone contacting Me personally for more details.
Ernie Casco (858) 568-1384

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My Speech LJ Town Council Nov 12th 2020

Hello my name is Ernie Casco La Jolla resident, senior pilot TPGP
We need LJTC help, protecting our La Jollas recreational freedom at the Gliderport.

We have a proven Recreational public Waiver, that would end the dispute,
An Easy fix could be done within a week.
Currently Working in LA , Colorado, and Yosemite I believe.

This would ....Effectively split Tandem /School operation... from public recreation freeflight.
The waiver would,...
Stop mandatory Club fees.
Stop Insurance Fees.
Both, ridiculous amounts of $.
By No contest, are illegal collection of funds. (not required by law.)

The waiver would also,...
Stop the signing of current unfair Wavers.
Stop the monopoly, the threat of violence, personal loss, false report and arrest, as they fight over power control & personal profit.

The Tandem/School would,...
Pay for their own insurance. (required by Law).
Pay for their oversight... needed for Public Safety.
San Diego City liabilities are already covered by California Recreational Statues Law.

A Recreational Waiver is working at other locations, where needed.
There are No waivers required at any of the other San Diego Sites.
The Recreational waiver restores public access.
Secures our recreational rights and freedom.
Provides a Safe Tandem /School operation.

It's a Win for the City, LJTC and the public rights ...
I'm asking LJTC to bring this to Agenda,
Provide recommendation & letter in support
Show Fair representation and End the dispute.

Reasons for signing

Commercialization of public land without public oversight is corruption.

Bob K. 03-23-2021

I have always flown as pilot responsible and even being forced to to pay to ushpa to fly at public lands is wrong and against my beliefs of freedom.

Keith S. 11-15-2020

The air has no wear and the concessionaire runs many different business at the site.

Carlos C. 11-16-2020

As shown here (and on the original page), I endorsed the MoveOn.org version of this petition on March 23, 2021 (over three and a half years ago). I am not a fan of the left wing sites where Eagle started the on-line versions of his petition (MoveOn.org and Change.org), but I overcame my objections and signed it anyway.

[Chris McKeon]

I read about how You Pilots down in Southern California are fighting the Raw Corruption that has been occurring down in San Diego. It's much worse than say sinking out and being forced to Land. My Hat is off to You Pilots who are fighting for having the Rite to Launch from a Strip of Cliff that: Heck as Tax Paying residents down there You Sandiego Pilots are in sense Legal Owners of the Tower Pines Launch. For what it is worth. I do hope that You San Diego Pilots will have success in regaining to have what is Yours: That is of Course the Tower Pines Launch.

So I hope to read a Futcher Post Here on the Hawks Website that goes something Like this: Torrey Pines Launch has been odically returned to the Rightful owners, The People of San Diego.

God Luck, Chris McKeon

[Craig Muhonen]

All That Has Been Written And All That Has Been Said.
I think that these two MEN speaking from the heart for two and a half hours on this relativity new format (call it a "podcast" if you will), did so much to sway left and right extremes, to a MUCH TRUER liberal way of understanding what is really going on in the world of "The Narrative", and allowed the TRUTH to shine through and win, win, win the election for the Republicans. Notwithstanding what is going on with USHPA and USHGA politically, this format I think (I know in my heart) could be carefully crafted and developed (using this podcast design) within US HAWKS into a thing that would gain attention among experienced "single pilot" enthusiasts to sit down with each other, (Bob and Ernie too), with a good microphone and good video equipment and speak from the heart about, among other things, the serious abuse of power at TPGP, A HISTORIC CITY PARK , (how quickly people forget) taken over recently by private commercial interests. If done properly, God only knows who would come forth to be interviewed on a "long form" format, without scripts or producers to get in the way. It is as JBP kind of said, "if you can think and speak clearly, that makes you the most dangerous person in the world".
LEARN HOW TO ASK THE RIGHT QUESTIONS OF THE PEOPLE YOU LOVE.

"THE WORLD IS MADE OUT OF WORDS"TM.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_3yOQl9E4I


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKtVBddSZBU


I always go back to my many experiences with "attacking" dogs who were trying to eat me as a Plumber, I stood up straight, did not look them in their eyes, but as soon as they started to use their nose and sniff me I got down to their level and played with them because I've learned that dogs only know two things, "I Love You and Put Me To Work". They live 1 year to our 7 years, but live every moment to the fullest if you let them.
People should be so humble and gracious.