[JoeF]

This note is about
"Tolerating Some Chordwise Sail Creases" for some causes in TPHG (tiny-packed hang gliders).

Assume SS sails, left and right. Tote the sails as separate items. Tolerate some chordwise creasing and pay the price for such toleration (inspection, testing, change of sail or patching sail. Hopefully with clear awareness of creasing, one may care for needed changes when due. Why tolerate some chordwise creasing? One reason could be to have a packing for tote that is wanted wherein some chordwise creasing occurs while getting a benefit of a faster assembly and disassembly at flight site. And perhaps to have a simpler wing with perhaps less mass. How long will the sail last under such acceptance? Etc.

One source of creasing that I am considering for one version of a TPHG is from zig-zag folding the sails and then wrapping such folded collection around my upper torso, so around an approximate circle of 9 inch radius; such will be some hit on the crease already formed by the zig-zag or accordion folding. The crease lines would be chordwise.

THERE MAY BE SOME ERRORS AND POOR ADVISE IN CHATGPT'S RESPONSE:

User
Assume SS sails, left and right. Tote the sails as separate items. Tolerate some chordwise creasing and pay the price for such toleration (inspection, testing, change of sail or patching sail. Hopefully with clear awareness of creasing, one may care for needed changes when due. Why tolerate some chordwise creasing? One reason could be to have a packing for tote that is wanted wherein some chordwise creasing occurs. How long will the sail last under such acceptance? Etc Are there ways to treat a creat to get some strength back at the crease? Any treatments? Patching?

ChatGPT
Tolerating some chordwise creasing in sails is a trade-off that sailors may choose to make for various reasons. Here are some aspects to consider:

Packing and Storage: One common reason for tolerating some creasing is for the convenience of packing and storing sails. Folding or rolling a sail tightly for storage can result in some chordwise creases. This might be acceptable if the sailor is more concerned with saving space and ease of transport than maximizing the lifespan of the sail.

Cost: Sails can be expensive, and replacing them frequently due to minor creases can be costly. Tolerating some creasing may be a cost-effective approach, especially for recreational sailors or those on a budget.

Temporary Use: In some cases, sailors may have backup sails or sails they intend to use temporarily. They might not be as concerned about creases in these sails if they are not intended for long-term or competitive use.

Awareness and Inspection: As you mentioned, being aware of creasing allows sailors to monitor the condition of the sail and make necessary repairs or replacements when needed. Regular inspection and maintenance can help extend the life of a sail even if it has some creases.

As for treating creases to restore strength, it depends on the material of the sail and the severity of the crease:

Mild Creases: Light creases may not significantly affect the sail's performance. Gently stretching the sail along the crease line or applying heat (with caution, depending on the material) might help reduce minor creases.

Moderate to Severe Creases: For more significant creases, you might consider patching the sail. This involves adding a reinforcing patch of sailcloth to the affected area. The patch should be securely attached to prevent further damage.

Professional Repairs: If the sail is valuable or extensively damaged, it's advisable to consult a professional sailmaker or sail repair service. They can assess the damage and provide guidance on whether the sail can be salvaged or if a replacement is necessary.

Prevention: To minimize creasing in the first place, proper sail handling and storage are essential. Avoid folding sails tightly along the same crease lines repeatedly, and store them in a cool, dry place to prevent mold and mildew growth.

The lifespan of a sail with creasing will vary depending on factors like the type of sailcloth, the severity of the creases, and how well it's cared for. Regular inspection and maintenance are key to ensuring that sails remain in good condition and that any necessary repairs or replacements are made promptly.




User
Could a sail strip of other material be placed where one is planning a folding? Is there a good tensile material that would better tolerate creasing .... better than Dacron sailcloth?
ChatGPT
Yes, you can reinforce a sail in areas where you plan to fold it by adding a sail strip made of a different material that is better suited to tolerate creasing. The purpose of such a strip is to distribute the stress and reduce wear and tear on the sailcloth, especially along fold lines. Here are some considerations for adding reinforcement strips:

Materials: When selecting a material for the reinforcement strip, you'll want to choose something that is durable and can withstand creasing. Some options to consider include Mylar film, Kevlar, or other high-strength, low-stretch materials. These materials are often more resistant to creasing compared to Dacron sailcloth.

Attachment: The reinforcement strip should be securely attached to the sail along the intended fold line. This can be done through stitching or adhesive bonding, depending on the material used and the sailmaker's recommendations.

Sizing: The width of the reinforcement strip should be chosen carefully to distribute the stress evenly along the fold line. It should be wide enough to provide adequate support but not so wide that it interferes with the sail's performance when unfolded.

Maintenance: Over time, even reinforced areas may still experience wear, so regular inspection and maintenance are essential. Check the reinforcement strip for any signs of damage or separation and repair it as needed.

Fold Patterns: Consider the specific folding pattern you plan to use and place the reinforcement strips accordingly. Different sails and sail plans may require different folding approaches, and the reinforcement should match the intended usage.

It's important to note that while adding reinforcement strips can help extend the life of a sail and reduce creasing damage, it may also add some weight and affect the sail's performance to some degree. Therefore, it's essential to strike a balance between durability and performance based on your specific sailing needs and conditions.

Consulting with a professional sailmaker or sail repair expert is advisable when considering such modifications to ensure that they are done correctly and do not negatively impact the sail's functionality. They can provide guidance on the most appropriate materials and techniques for reinforcing your sail.

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One of the reasons former posted notes wrestled with segmenting the sails was to achieve a no-creasing sail while still having a tiny-packing of the sail. That still is very attractive and will be profoundly explored.
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[JoeF]

This note explores three-part queen posts or downtubes, the side tubes of the triangle control frame (TCF) in relation to possible TPHG (tiny-packed hang glider) designs.

In positive flight loading, the queenposts are in stark compression. Some manufacturers have placed an insert inside the queenposts in the post's central section for beefing up buckling resistance; that has the queenpost be of two parts making up the beam to serve. Long queenposts face buckling potentials more than short queenposts; longer posts play roles of importance for some hang gliders. The 5 ft limit of topic may put a burden of design on some TPHG designers, developers, makers, and users. One workaround for a longer queenpost in a TPHG is to use two parts or three part to make up the queenpost where the two or three parts are less than 5 ft, but the makeup is longer than 5 ft. Watch here for a neat opportunity to have beefed up buckling resistance by choosing to have the two-part or three-part queenpost.

A simple two part post: Overlap two short parts where the overlap region gives beefed-up buckling resistance. Overlap in central region of the post may be by external or internal means.

A three part option: Have the post have end parts one size and the central region third part be of more robust larger-diameter and/or thicker wall tubing. Net a bonus of beefed-up buckling resistance. Two Joe Strap-and-Collar might be used in this option for each post, total of four Joe Strap-and-Collar parts might be used; there is a potential for elastic Joe Strap-and Collar for lowering shock at heavy positive gusts.

[JoeF]

This note invites brainstorming by anyone on a particular challenge that occurs when choosing to join sail strips by means of having the edges of the two sail neighbors joined by the double near castellation slit-hem scheme where two rib battens weave through respectively every other loop in the hems of the two sail-segment edges. A happy means has not yet been found for inserting the two rib-battens at the joining station; the means tried so far have shown to be too time-consuming. At a join the hems overlap to the width of the two batten ribs. The two batten ribs will play to serve what traditionally is served by one batten rib pocketed on a HG sail.

Note: the slit hems keep all material, so castellation may not be the best term; however, the selection of every other loop formed by one of the two batten ribs has the effect of castellation for the experience of that one batten rib; the second batten rib weaves by using also every other loop and thus experiences its own castellation. Together 100% of the two sail edges participate in the join for anti-pull-apart result.

At assembly, the weaving of the two batten ribs at one join station is the challenging operation. The design scheme is attractive to some designers, save the onerous cost of time to do the assembly. Anyone is invited to brainstorm of speeding up the operation of weaving the two batten ribs into their respective loops. Of 14 or so stations are intended, the assembly task just become too long; how might the operation be done to shorten the time cost?

Desired: Whatever is done, aim to keep the upper surface of the chordwise join line smooth for good airflow over the wing.

=====================================
I'll start, others may contribute and maybe mention some scheme that will win the day on this challenge.
controllable electrical opening something that bares every other loop for the first of the two batten ribs; then off that and then on the other set of hem loops for receiving the second batten loop.

air-inflated something that opens every other hem loop to receive the first batten rib; then off that set and so same for the second set of hem loops for receiving the second batten rib.

Insert a small spring permanently; but spring will be weak enough to flatten when the sail in flight is tensioned.

Have five helpers do the weaving.

Weave a very flexible film fided tubing; anchor that tubing; insert the batten rib into the film tubing; extract the fidding tubing and store that tool for next flight session.

... your turn....

[JoeF]

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Description of the Double-Castle Method of joining adjacent sail segments with two weaved batten-ribs probably needs some improvement. Each batten rib goes through about half of the loops of one sail edge and half the loops of the other sail-strip edge. Then the second batten rib at the same station goes through about half the loops of one sail strip and half the loops of the other sail strip. Thus each batten rib goes through a count of loops that match the count of one sail strip. This forces that the two batten ribs stack vertically (spoken as though the plane of the wing is horizontal or approximately parallel to the surface of the Earth). Looking at the result from above or below the wing, one does not see the batten ribs except at perhaps the two ends of the whole arrangement. At packing time it is super quick to withdraw the two batten ribs per join station. But at assembly of the HG, weaving the two rib battens is proving challenging, thus the invitation for brainstorming on the challenge that one finds in the prior post.


Suggestive mockup of Double Castle Method of joining sail segments while aiming to have no sail creases while still tiny packing the sail segments in some TPHG (tiny-packed hang glider). Placing rib-batten #1 and then #2 is a time-cost challenge; we are seeking some fast means to place the rib-battens at the flying site. Withdrawing the rib-battens is a superfast operation. It is the assembly that challenges. May creativity find some tolerable means of assembly. A TPHG might have perhaps 7 stations on each side wing; if a quick method or tolerable method is not found, then the Double Castle means of joining adjacent sail segments might not be chosen by anyone for their HG.

The eleven photos of a papered mockup is only a start of a problem-solving effort for the mentioned challengehttps://ushawks.org/forum/post ... ca61157ec#:

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Compare Double Castle with door hinges. A door hinge has one hinge pin and captures much less than 100% of each sided flat plate. The Double Castle [b]captures 100%[/b] of each sail segment's edge being joined.
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Fillers:

Copy of article on the Hall Quadruplane
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[Bob Kuczewski]

At packing time it is super quick to withdraw the two batten ribs per join station. But at assembly of the HG, weaving the two rib battens is proving challenging, thus the invitation for brainstorming on the challenge that one finds in the prior post.

I apologize if either you or ChatGPT has already suggested this, but you might attach a thin cord to the tip of the battens when withdrawing them from the sail. Then leave the thin cord inside the joined sections when folding or rolling. Installation involves reattaching the battens to the cord and pulling them through the castellations to install them.

By the way, the double castle is very clever!!

[JoeF]

Nice add, Bob.
Let's see what happens with that suggestion: there will be too loose strings left in the runs, one per castle run; the sail segments will still be loosely integrated, but accordion folding seems to be able to occur; there might be a light bunching at the two edges of the accordion stack; that bunching might be pack tolerable; I will experiment with that; then wrapping the accordion stack of loosely integrated sail segments around the backpack or pilot torso would be the deals.
Then at next flight session, connect the first batten rib to the helper string; anchor the sail segment strip; pull the helper string that now tows the batten rib; keep the connection of the helper string to the leading nose of the batten rib and pull the batten rib into the set of castles; do similarly for the other batten rib of that sail station. This feels real good. My notes wanted that but working rapidly I rashly rejected the path as I was forcing loose non-integrated sail segments. Your offer has us visit the deal and perhaps a loose small string in each of the two runs may not give intolerable bunching at the edge of the stacking of sail segments; the zig-zag or accordion stacking would not be of fully separated sail segments (though separable when wanted for repair or cleaning or replacement). Your cooperative offer has me excited that my rejection in notes for having a deal of non-integrated sail segments was my loss; your offer just may bring the deal back to a nice gain. Excited to try the deal out soon.
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Without having the above perhaps nice deal, today I furthered some other helper means: a weak tiny U spring bonded to the edge of each loop that will be receiving the penetrating rib batten would allow smooth quick entry of a batten rib, especially if the batten rib was with a nice polished rounded conical penetrating tip. Still finding the opening at each loop in the castle set slows things. Bob's suggestion above, if all goes will, overcomes that seeking of the loop entries. The three problems of stacking and interleaving of the castles from the two neighbor edges and hard-to-enter castles (of two layers when flat) and the finding of the castle entries may neatly disappear with Bob's suggestion; that would be fun, and so worth fully exploring.

Today I proved out the fundamental Double Castle joining on a wing that was flown today under tether; the three neighbor sails joined using two stations where two batten ribs were in each station did just fine. A found tip or probably must is the following: The LE and TE of the batten ribs should be tied snug with a lashing or the like; the two LE tips of the two batten ribs should not be left to flail. Same for the two tips at the TE.

Next, during the flight session it came to me that having sail segment strips of 48" width could nicely wrap the backpack that has cross-section of 2"x12" and length of 5 feet. Such would be an alternative to narrower sail segments and human-torso wrapping of the accordion-stack of sail segments. And if Bob's batten-rib pull-string-left-in-the-castles allows for efficient pull-in of the batten ribs, then we are near good-to-go! Will try it all out soon!
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First exploration of Bob's suggestion:
For zero overlap, zero creasing: the small-diameter helper strings stay in place with some detail cares; then the sail segments stack accordion style just fine; but the interleaving of the two castle is lost. At assembly a tautening of the loose helper strings sets up an order opportunity for getting the interleaving of castles set up; some nudging to get the interleaving enough aligned might not be onerous as the helper strings if played with some tautness will help. After the interleave is set, then indeed the pull strings (if the tailing part of the sail at that station is anchored to something; and if the nose of the batten rib is rounded and not snaggy, then the helper line pulls the batten rib through the castles (about half the castles of both sail hemmed sail segments. Detach the helper string and store it until disassembly; there will be two helper strings per station; if the HG has 8 stations for this matter, then 16 helper strings will be part of the gear and tote deal. Really thin Spectra or Dyneema fishing line would serve. Appropriate join of the helper line to the batten-rib for the pullings would be used. I think we have a winner in Bob's suggestion.

For the case when overlap and interleave is some kept while using the helper string: If the interleaving and overlap of the join is kept, then bulking and creasing become a challenge for wrapping the stack of sail segments for tote. So, in this early blush, using the above zero-overlap with very loose helper string and some loss of the interleaving of castles is winning my favor. Time and practice will distinguish matters. Get the interleaving needed may be more doable if when the helper string is made taut before the insertion of the batten rib.
Let's call the "helper string" the "Bob String"?????? Then we might have a TPHG with Joe Straps and Bob Strings!
========
=============For fun, I let ChatGPT perhaps clean up my above discourse; see below for ChatGPT's offer:

User
Please clean up the text without losing any idea. [I fed the text and below is what was generated.]
ChatGPT
Great addition, Bob!

Let's see what happens with that suggestion: there will be too loose strings left in the runs, one per castle run; the sail segments will still be loosely integrated, but accordion folding seems to be able to occur; there might be a light bunching at the two edges of the accordion stack; that bunching might be pack tolerable; I will experiment with that; then wrapping the accordion stack of loosely integrated sail segments around the backpack or pilot torso would be the deals.

Then at the next flight session, connect the first batten rib to the helper string; anchor the sail segment strip; pull the helper string that now tows the batten rib; keep the connection of the helper string to the leading nose of the batten rib and pull the batten rib into the set of castles; do similarly for the other batten rib of that sail station. This feels really good. My notes wanted that but working rapidly, I rashly rejected the path as I was forcing loose non-integrated sail segments. Your offer has us visit the deal, and perhaps a loose small string in each of the two runs may not give intolerable bunching at the edge of the stacking of sail segments; the zig-zag or accordion stacking would not be of fully separated sail segments (though separable when wanted for repair or cleaning or replacement). Your cooperative offer has me excited that my rejection in notes for having a deal of non-integrated sail segments was my loss; your offer just may bring the deal back to a nice gain. Excited to try the deal out soon.

=====

Without having the above perhaps nice deal, today I furthered some other helper means: a weak tiny U spring bonded to the edge of each loop that will be receiving the penetrating rib batten would allow smooth quick entry of a batten rib, especially if the batten rib was with a nice polished rounded conical penetrating tip. Still finding the opening at each loop in the castle set slows things. Bob's suggestion above, if all goes well, overcomes that seeking of the loop entries. The three problems of stacking and interleaving of the castles from the two neighbor edges and hard-to-enter castles (of two layers when flat) and the finding of the castle entries may neatly disappear with Bob's suggestion; that would be fun, and so worth fully exploring.

Today I proved out the fundamental Double Castle joining on a wing that was flown today under tether; the three neighbor sails joined using two stations where two batten ribs were in each station did just fine. A found tip or probably must is the following: The LE and TE of the batten ribs should be tied snug with a lashing or the like; the two LE tips of the two batten ribs should not be left to flail. Same for the two tips at the TE.

Next, during the flight session, it came to me that having sail segment strips of 48" width could nicely wrap the backpack that has a cross-section of 2"x12" and a length of 5 feet. Such would be an alternative to narrower sail segments and human-torso wrapping of the accordion-stack of sail segments. And if Bob's batten-rib pull-string-left-in-the-castles allows for efficient pull-in of the batten ribs, then we are near good-to-go! Will try it all out soon!

======================== ========================

First exploration of Bob's suggestion: For zero overlap, zero creasing: the small-diameter helper strings stay in place with some detail cares; then the sail segments stack accordion-style just fine; but the interleaving of the two castles is lost. At assembly, tautening the loose helper strings sets up an order opportunity for getting the interleaving of castles set up; some nudging to get the interleaving sufficiently aligned might not be onerous as the helper strings, if played with some tautness, will help. After the interleave is set, then indeed the pull strings (if the trailing part of the sail at that station is anchored to something; and if the nose of the batten rib is rounded and not snaggy, then the helper line pulls the batten rib through the castles (about half the castles of both sail-hemmed sail segments). Detach the helper string and store it until disassembly; there will be two helper strings per station; if the HG has 8 stations for this matter, then 16 helper strings will be part of the gear and tote deal. Really thin Spectra or Dyneema fishing line would serve. Appropriate join of the helper line to the batten-rib for the pullings would be used. I think we have a winner in Bob's suggestion.

For the case when overlap and interleave is somewhat kept while using the helper string: If the interleaving and overlap of the join is kept, then bulking and creasing become a challenge for wrapping the stack of sail segments for the tote. So, in this early blush, using the above zero-overlap with a very loose helper string and some loss of the interleaving of castles is winning my favor. Time and practice will distinguish matters. Getting the interleaving needed may be more doable if when the helper string is made taut before the insertion of the batten rib. Let's call the "helper string" the "Bob String"?????? Then we might have a TPHG with Joe Straps and Bob Strings!

CLARIFICATION: My notes did not have the "loose" in a "fidding"/fishing helper line. Have a tiny strong line that is very loose allowing full hinging in accordion stacking is important, I think. Bob supplied the "loose" deal which may be the kernel saving quality of the helper string. And my notes had "cord", not tiny string. Tiny string with the very small diameter may be part of the grace of the Bob String. Since the re-interleaving challenge is not fully solved, the Bob String may cure about 2/3rds of the particular challenge.

[JoeF]

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This morning I awakened with a form of what I immediately named B-J Hidden Loop (BJHL). A different name may one day rise for the device. B stands for "Bob" as in Bob Kuczewski. J stands for "Joe" as in yours truly. The form serves as the Bob String while going further to address other neighbor needs.
Needs near:
One may not want to lose the Bob String.
One may not want to stow the Bob String in some new separate compartment.
One may want to stop the flail of the ends of two stacked batten-ribs.

Let's see what the BJHL looks like and where it is and how it operates. BJHL is a loop of fine strong string that loops through both runs of castle loops in the Double Castle scheme of joining two sail segments. The BJHL is "loose" in that there is plenty of excess length of string in the BJHL. In flight, one does not particularly see any of the BJHL except if one looks real carefully at the TE, see further. The BJHL stays put in the sail segments during tote; the BJHJ cannot get lost as it loops the sail segment just where it is needed for the function that the Bob String served: the pulling in of a batten rib during assembly. Unlike the Bob String, the BJHL is immediately already stowed as it simply stays put and cannot drop away or get lost. The BJHL looseness plays a big role in the packing for tote as the looseness allows a zero-overlap hinging of one sail strip to the neighbor sail strip. In the BJHL the looseness could play a second important role and simplify things from former procedures; the additional role could be a using of the looseness excess loop string to lash the two ends of the stacked batten ribs. Just lash the ends of the batten ribs with some of the excess BJHL and put a twist in the end and set the tiny twist micro loop on one of the tips of the batten rib or use some other tiny means to set the lashing. Such use fulfills the key anti-flail need; there is no additional storage action needed.

Before anti-flail tying the two ends of batten ribs at at a batten-rib sail-segment-joining station, the BJHL is to serve the needs that a Bob String served. Here is how the one BJHL operates to serve the pulling in of both batten ribs: Upon opening from toted pack the sail-segment set, lay out the macro sail on the ground; the BJHL in tote had its looseness allow a zero-overlap and hinging of adjacent sail segments; now at assembly a procedural step is to make the BJHL taut while also anchoring and making the station of operation taut. Use of environmental anchors or the like may help. With the station sails parts and BJHL taut and jiggled, a nudging of castle overlapping will be needed to assure the interleaving of the two castle runs is the result. Then the BJHL ---having a tiny inline sub-loop with tiny sleeve--- has the subloop integrate with a hole in a batten rib; the tiny sleeve helps the pulling process for anti-snag purposes. then the BJHL can pull in the batten rib. Upon getting one batten rib in place, remove the the tiny-subloop from the just-pulled-in batten rib. Then do same for the other batten rib using the now-available tiny subloop and tiny sleeve. Rotate the BJHL to pull in the second batten rib. Then remove the hold on the batten rib. Then the looseness of the BJHL is shared at both ends of the batten rib; use the looseness to anti-flail lash the ends of the two stacked batten ribs. Set the lashing. Done with that station. Do such similarly at each batten-rib station.

At each batten rib station instead of having two Bob Strings that needed storage and could be lost, have the two replaced by one BJHL loop that stays ever inside the two castle runs of a batten-rib station.

At packing time: undo the integration of sail with LE, then just undo the anti-flail lashings at the batten-rib tips, drop the BJHL, lightly anchor the sail at one end; pull out the two batten ribs gently. Once all the batten ribs are out of their castles, then anchor the keel end of the macro left or right sail set and lightly nudge the full set of sail segments by pulling on the wing-tip region of the sail set in order to get the BJHL looseness to allow the zero overlap of adjacent sail segments and still allow a hinging for accordion fold-up of the sail. Once the accordion collapse is arranged, the stack of segment strips is ready for wrapping onto the backpack or pilot torso or cylinder-like balloon jig and then mounted on a travois for trek.

After the macro sail has its batten-ribs integrating the sail segments and the anti-flail lashings are complete, it would be time to mount the sail onto the frame of the TPHG. The sail segments that are at the LE region would be specially designed; there are variations depending on scheme of attachment. Such design concern is left to other posted notes by me or others.

NOTE: If chordwise creases are tolerated in the sail and if wrap-sail bulking is tolerated, then overlapped castles may remain in place, the sail need not be pulled spanwise to get zero overlap for sail packing. With the two tolerations, then assembly can face "already interleaved castles" which could save a chunk of time. The tolerations of chordwise crease and pack bulking brings some costs. Evaluate that cost against the saved time at assembly to make a choice. The "bulking" arrives from the remaining interleave of castles; that is, the two adjacent sail segments joined results in a point thickness of four fabric thicknesses whereas the mid region of the sail is just one thickness. The looseness of the BJHL and the pulling apart of sail segment edges to get ready for accordion folding has two-layers of sailcloth at the hem; that two-layers still has a station bulking when sail wrapping for tote. Tolerating the four-layer region in sail wrapping would see a undulation or bump in the wrap. Wrapping rigging lines with the wrapping of sail might de-bump the wrap some. Experience will teach. Paul McCready taught his sons to learn as one goes.

[Bob Kuczewski]

Let's call the "helper string" the "Bob String"??????

Thanks very much, but I think "batten threading string" would be a better name.

BJHL01onOct3of2023.jpg

This morning I awakened with a form of what I immediately named B-J Hidden Loop (BJHL). A different name may one day rise for the device. B stands for "Bob" as in Bob Kuczewski. J stands for "Joe" as in yours truly.

I would prefer to give you first billing because I believe you had the idea earlier. JB also has a nicer ring to it.

[JoeF]

JBHL stands for same as BJHL: a loop of line that assists in many functions at a batten-rib station in a HG that joins adjacent sail sections using the Double Castle scheme. The line may be a strong Dyneema or Spectra or Kevlar fishing line or the like. On the JBHL may be a tiny conical sleeve and a sub loop to assist in pulling batten-ribs into castles.

Regarding the need for anchoring sail segments and also tauten the JBHL when completing batten-rib assembly using the Double Castle scheme of sail assembly:
Additional waking advance in the region of JBHL: There is seen a need to tauten both sail sections just at the sewn line of the hem, just adject to the slits that make the castles. Where are the anchors to tauten those sail points? Waking, a scheme came to ming: Use a leading edge tube: Use four tiny bungee lines with tiny hooks perhaps on both ends of the tiny bungee lines; or have a Y bungee for each end of the sail. Connect the tiny bungee to both the sail edges and then connect the other end of the tiny bungee to a leading edge tube section (the tube is not yet assemble, so is available to be a beam useful in sail assembly). Presto, the two sails at the needed points are tautened. Such tautening is a setup for assuring that the castle interleaving occurs. The JBHL loop line can be similarly tautened using the same tool (a leading edge tube still loose and available to be moved from batten-rib station to the next batten-rib station during the assembly of the sail from packed sail segments. As soon as the castles are interleaved, then the JBHL can do its next job: the pulling in of batten ribs and then the cinching of the batten-rib tips (front and back). Next: unlodge the bungees and move to set things at the next batten-rib station. Before too long the sail is fully assembled. Go put the frame together and then place the sail on the frame.
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One alternative to segmenting a sail is to have a traditional unsegmented sail! Tiny packing unsegmented sail may put creases chordwise; one may avoid spanwise creasing by judicious wrapping onto spar sets for polite backpack. Unsegmented sails could have batten-rib pockets. Such traditional already-fully-made sails will not have all that detail todo that the Double Castle with batten-rib join scheme has. One would need a substantial motivation to involve sail segmentation and Double Castle join scheme. [ ] So, why might one use sail segmentation and the Double Castle batten-rib scheme???

Some motivations for sail segmentation and Double Castle scheme with batten-ribs:
Avoid chordwise and spanwise sail creases.
Opportunity to change out sail-segment strips to other materials, new materials, repaired materials, decorations, ...
Opportunity to have sail toted in a variety of ways and places.
Firm in-sail battening.
?
to be continued by me or anyone else seeing some advantages.

[JoeF]

Some more motivations for maybe choosing sail segmentation:
When repairing an area of the sail, one need only handle one strip of the sail, rather than move around the full sail.
Provides opportunity to change color pattern of the HG sail for different occasions.

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I had ChatGPT summarize some draft notes I made about today's adventure trip on bus and train where I explored dimensions, ease, etc., on a crowed bus and crowded train:

ChatGPT
It sounds like you had quite an adventurous day and came up with some interesting ideas and observations during your trek, bus, and train trip! Let's break down your insights:

Frontal Carry for a Long Pack:
You found that carrying a five-foot long pack in front of you is safer on a crowded bus compared to carrying it as a backpack. This can make sense in crowded spaces where a large backpack might inconvenience others or even pose safety concerns.

Arch Kite Design:
You experimented with an arch kite design where the tailing is provided by the traverse to the wind arch line, and the pitch high line sets the kite surface for stability. This innovation could potentially result in a more stable kite design for recreational purposes.

Preparation for Beach Treks:
You made a note to prepare at least ten small, well-working kites for treks to the beach. This suggests you plan to enjoy some kite flying on your beach trips. Additionally, you reminded yourself to pack some essential supplies like food bars, an apple, and water for these treks. Staying hydrated and having snacks is always a good idea when spending time outdoors.

Two-Crutch Solution for Hang Glider:
You mentioned a two-crutch solution for a tiny-packed hang glider, which seems to be a winning scheme in your opinion. This solution might involve using two special crutches for support during transport. Furthermore, you suggested that off the bus, these crutches could be converted into a three-wheeled wagon that can be pulled by webbing. This versatile design could be beneficial for transporting the hang glider and its equipment more efficiently.

It's great to see your creativity and practical thinking in your notes. These ideas and observations can lead to innovative solutions and make your future trips and activities more enjoyable and efficient.

Joe:
I took a 7 foot fiberglass rod and discovered that such length just won't work well for bus riding. At most a 6-ft long package will barely work; but 5-ft long or less starts to be the way to go for transporting tiny-packed hang glider.

ChatGPT
Thank you for sharing your additional insights on the ideal length for transporting a tiny-packed hang glider on a bus. It's valuable information that can help others who may be considering similar transportation challenges. It seems like you've identified that a 5-foot long package or even shorter is the most practical length for bus riding when it comes to carrying a tiny-packed hang glider. This will likely make it easier to navigate crowded spaces and ensure a more comfortable and convenient transport experience. Your practical observations will be beneficial for planning future trips and adventures with your hang glider equipment.

Also, during the adventure of discovery, I am more convinced that a bicycle could be modified to neatly carry a TPHG and placed on bus' bike racks and carried in the bike area inside the Metro-Rail bike space. Must build out this direction along with the other formats to transport a TPHG.