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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Tue Nov 21, 2023 1:34 pm

TDHGClogo001.jpg
First logo of the TDHGC
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Tensegrity-Disk HG of 16-ft Diameter
:arrow: Area of circular disk: A=πr^2=π8^2=64π=200 approximately.
:arrow: Disk perimeter would be main spar. C=πd Here d=16 C=50 approximately. So for happy tote(to tune of this topic thread) maybe 10 or 11 segments of 5-ft length? Or some kind of coilable deal.
:arrow: KP-QP subassembly would be beam-like. (two KPs and two QPs where a stiff X is formed to act as a beam); this X might add four (4) segments for the happy tote. Thus, about 15 segments would enter the happy tote packing.
:arrow: The disk perimeter spar and KP-QP subassembly would be stayed by upper and lower rigging pre-tensed to result in a tensegrity complex. :arrow: The perimeter spar could be seen as a captive arch; the sail would tend to keep the disk perimeter spar captive to its shape; in combination with the upper and lower rigging shape may be kept stable.
:arrow: Exploring shape failure modes and spar/beam failure modes would be part of the exploration.

I fed the above as a prompt to ChatGPT3.5 and below is the response:
Embarking on the Exploration of the Tensegrity-Disk Hang Glider: 16-ft Diameter

Design Overview:

:arrow: Circular Disk Dimensions: The hang glider boasts a striking 16-ft diameter, resulting in a circular disk with an area (A) of approximately 200 square feet (πr^2 = π8^2 = 64π ≈ 200).

:arrow: Main Spar and Perimeter: The perimeter of the disk serves as the main spar, and its circumference (C) is calculated as π times the diameter (d), yielding a value of 50. To facilitate portability, envisioning the main spar as a series of 10 or 11 segments, each measuring 5 feet, could make for a "happy tote" solution, perhaps in a coilable configuration.

:arrow: KP-QP Subassembly as a Structural Beam: The design incorporates a beam-like structure formed by two KPs and two QPs, arranged in a stiff X configuration. This adds an additional four segments to the tote, resulting in around 15 segments for convenient packing.

:arrow: Tensegrity System: The hang glider relies on a tensegrity system, with the upper and lower rigging pre-tensed to establish a stable and resilient structure. The circular disk's perimeter spar can be likened to a captive arch, with the sail working in concert to maintain its captive form. This synergy between the sail and rigging ensures the overall stability of the hang glider.

:arrow: Shape Stability Exploration: A pivotal aspect of this exploration involves delving into potential shape failure modes and assessing the vulnerabilities of both the circular disk's perimeter spar and the KP-QP subassembly. Understanding these failure modes is crucial for refining the design and ensuring the utmost safety and performance in flight.

Embarking on the exploration of this Tensegrity-Disk Hang Glider promises not only a thrilling aerial experience but also a comprehensive investigation into the dynamics of shape stability and structural integrity.


What I did not feed the ChatGPT3.5 was the following furthering exploration:
The sail may have different sizes of pocketing and treatments to address airfoil formation via possible rods and/or stuffers or appliques to top or bottom of sail. DS and SS sails could be explored for TDHGs. Fundamental diameters may change to fit needs of a particular pilot. And some in the TDHGC might explore different-than-circle ovalities.
Notice the lack of mention of "keel" or "spreader" beams. A specialized community Tensegrity Disk HG Club might evolve. :wave:
I am a member of the TDHGC without yet making a wing to serve my membership. :thumbup: :yawn: One of my membership actions is the founding of the club and the posting hereon of a broad invitation to others to join the club.

ChatGPT seems to vibrate over ovalities:
TDHGC member
What would you understand if the sail disk had different "ovalities" other than circular?

ChatGPT
Introducing different "ovalities" to the sail disk, rather than maintaining a perfectly circular shape, would have several implications for the Tensegrity-Disk Hang Glider design:

Aerodynamic Considerations: Varying the shape from a perfect circle could influence the aerodynamics of the hang glider. Different ovalities may result in altered lift and drag characteristics, affecting overall flight performance and maneuverability.

Structural Challenges: The introduction of non-circular shapes may require adjustments to the tensegrity system and structural components. Ensuring the stability and integrity of the hang glider becomes a more complex task, as the forces acting on the sail and the overall structure would differ with varying shapes.

Weight Distribution: Different ovalities could impact the distribution of weight across the hang glider. This, in turn, may affect the balance and stability during flight. Engineers would need to carefully analyze how changes in shape influence the center of gravity and make corresponding adjustments.

Control and Handling: The handling characteristics of the hang glider could be affected by variations in shape. Pilots may experience different control responses, and the glider's behavior in various flight conditions may be influenced by the shape of the sail disk.

Material Stress: Non-circular shapes may subject the materials used in construction to varying stress patterns. Engineers would need to ensure that the materials can withstand these stresses and that the hang glider maintains structural integrity throughout its intended use.

Research and Testing: The exploration of different ovalities would likely involve extensive research and testing, both in simulations and real-world conditions. Understanding how these changes impact performance, stability, and safety is crucial before implementing such variations in a practical hang glider design.

In summary, introducing different ovalities to the sail disk represents a shift from the conventional circular design and would necessitate a thorough reevaluation of aerodynamics, structural integrity, weight distribution, control dynamics, and material considerations. This exploration could lead to innovative designs but requires careful analysis and testing to ensure a safe and efficient hang glider.
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby dhmartens » Tue Nov 21, 2023 8:05 pm

I cannot risk the telescopic prototype in these 50 mpg gusts we are experiencing. But a rubber latex sail can change shape as the frame shifts from alpha to t2.
Some content:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWnyWNLgupQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrhke8Q0Pz4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXg-qoRN0co
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEy3X-bXG2M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gmBK2Je5VE
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Wed Nov 22, 2023 11:18 pm

Doug's "universal HG sail" .... :!: :!: :!: Alpha to T2 :!:
================================================

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Suggestive only:
https://www.structuremag.org/wp-content ... -sd-16.jpg
https://www.structuremag.org/wp-content ... -sd-15.png
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TDHGroughsketch001.jpg
Rough sketch toward Tensegrity-Disk Hang Glider
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby dhmartens » Thu Nov 23, 2023 6:58 pm

I made a few quick test flight videos of the Telescopic Hang Glider prototype today.

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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Thu Nov 23, 2023 9:49 pm

Fun adventures, Doug!
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1876
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====================
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Mon Nov 27, 2023 9:08 am


Ozone's Fusion Wing
LEI (pos inflated) and DS with ram-air inflation for cavities aft of LE ... Fabric ribs.
What might this all say to happy-packing HGs within the realms implied in this present topic thread?
:?: :idea:
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Tue Nov 28, 2023 8:18 am

Would this be included in the TDHGC? Flying saucer HG? Disk HG? Circle HG?
https://ushawks.org/forum/download/file.php?id=12972
FlyingSaucerHGDisk.png
Toward solutions in TDHGC
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AerophileSPELL.jpg
Toward solutions in TDHGC
AerophileSPELL.jpg (130.1 KiB) Viewed 916 times


l'Aerophile
L’Aérophile ("The Aerophile") was a French aviation magazine published from 1893 to 1947. It has been described as "the leading aeronautical journal of the world" around 1910.

https://www.loc.gov/rr/scitech/trs/trslaerophile.html For researchers.
And https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/cb344143803/date

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Rigging study from early L'Aerophile:
LAerophileClipRiggingStudy.png
LAerophileClipRiggingStudy.png (48.28 KiB) Viewed 916 times

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Filler. 1910. Rail launch. Clip from issue of L'Aerophile, January 15, 1910.
January1910LAerophileClipPage54.jpg
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=======================================================
GradeMonoplaneCompareSantosDumont1909circaTCF.png
Clipped from 1909 L'Aerophile regarding Grade monoplane
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Thu Nov 30, 2023 11:03 am

My answer to the question at the top of the above post about the tensegrity membership in TDHGC for the HG in the first photograph shown in that post is "yes." Notice that the disk HG has not a kingpost but does have two queen posts. Note that the sail is pressed by the queenposts. The sail is a broad set of tensed lines; the lower flight rigging lines pull the ring frame member while the two queenposts are pressing the sail; the queenposts are held in space only by lines (though the sail is a set of lines in tension; the flight lines are in tension during flight. The ring frame member is floating only via tensed lines. Thus the core of the wing is a tensegrity deal. Let the central rib be seen as a spreader of compression to tense the sail.

No-kingpost tensegrity:
TDHGCmemberYes.jpg
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Thu Nov 30, 2023 4:07 pm



I hold that a single tendon and a single beam (as example in the bowed beam in archery) is an elemental tensegrity. :D
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Re: The 5 ft-packed-HG Movement

Postby JoeF » Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:29 pm

Bow of bows tensegrity?
Image
Maker also explored ringing similar bows of bows.

Some thinkers allow bowed or not-straight beams in tensegrities; other insist that beams be straight. Non-straight beams might be angled beams, bowing beams, ... When not defined carefully, the beams by default may be non-straight beams, and thus bowed beams get included.

Pure tensegrities might disallow bows since the bowed beam has compression on one side and tension on the the other side, hence tension and compression are not strictly separated. Such purity affects my prior choice that a one-tendon and one bowing beam might stand as a most simple tensegrity. However, with such challenge I am thinking a most elemental tensegrity might be a a hollow beam with the tendon interior of the tube beam where bowing is carefully avoided by keeping the tendon's action so bowing is avoided when tensed; the tube would be set into compression.

Careful analysis might see "straight" rods/beams as nearly impossible deals; even the slightest out-of-column result from axial compression sets up some tension on one side of the rod/beam.

Some tensegrity workers think a three-beam tensegrity is the most simple. I am not in that camp. Extensive attention on definitions and allowances can be garnered from wrestling over the matters on page: https://web.archive.org/web/20201127053852/https://tensegritywiki.com/wiki/Definitions_of_Tensegrity
and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tensegrity

Related: Note: not the full article:
A new flexural-tensegrity bow
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0094114X21001567

It will be a story on just how tensegrity will play in HG "happy packs" of the coming era in the spirit of the topic of this discussion thread.
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