[tomsines27]

Hi, Happy to be here. Looking forward learning as much as I can about hanggliders. I`m a pilot, however I`ve never flown a hangglider. Also, I`n an inventor. You see one of my inventions at http://electricevette.com. I have been designing, and building model hanggliders for several years, in order to build the lightest hangglider possible. I have had a brake through, and I`m now ready to build a full size hangglider. I believe its possible a build a 30 to 35 pound hangglider. I would like to know, could anyone here speak to me about this. By the way, thanks Bob for helping me get on this site.
Tom Sines

[Bob Kuczewski]

Hello Tom, and ...

Welcome to the US Hawks!!!     

I checked out your web site and your "EVette" is an amazing piece of engineering!!   

I hope you don't mind if I post a few photos and videos here ...

Photos:

evettehome.jpg (38.31 KiB) Viewed 16278 times

Webpic.1.jpg (131.83 KiB) Viewed 16278 times

ElectricCar.JPG (148.22 KiB) Viewed 16278 times

Videos:

[tomsines27]

I have a few questions I hope to get answers for here . My first one is , for an average hangglider of 70lbs, and a 32ft wing span, that is the weight of the fabric?
Tom Sines

[Bill Cummings]

I have a few questions I hope to get answers for here . My first one is , for an average hangglider of 70lbs, and a 32ft wing span, that is the weight of the fabric?
Tom Sines

Wow! I'm seriously out of date on that question. I haven't kept current on our fabric.
In the early days I seem to recall that we were using 3.8oz stabilized, rip stop, Dacron that was good for carrying a load of more than 100 lbs per square foot and we were only loading it at about 1.5 or 1.(something) pounds per square foot.
The concern of overloading it was not even a ---well---concern.
The last time I was paying attention we were seeing heaver fabric being used.
Sorry. I'm just not up to speed on this subject.
So if anyone can help two of us out here it would be appreciated.

EDIT: I'll bet the Wills Wing website will have something on it about fabric weight.

[tomsines27]

Hi Bill, Thanks for your help. Some of my questions may seem elemantary, but they are important yo me. Can you tell me, what the square foot of an average hangglider wing, of 32ft is?
Tom Sines

[tomsines27]

Hi, I`m not making my clear. I`m talking about total weight of the fabric for the entire hangglider, with a 32ft wing span.
Tom Sines

[Bill Cummings]

Over at:
http://willswing.com/info_bulletins/enews.asp?reqENewsIdx=1#Eagle
I see a 32' Eagle 164 as the mid size with a smaller 145 having a wing span of 30'.
The 180 at 33'3".
The 164sq' weighs 58.5lbs with a pilot weight range of 150 to 250lbs.($3,475.00) It's HGMA Certified.
I would guess the 32’ 164sq’ to be close to other Novice rated gliders.

[Bill Cummings]

Hi, I`m not making my clear. I`m talking about total weight of the fabric for the entire hangglider, with a 32ft wing span.
Tom Sines

I would have to dig a bit to find that information.
It would be safe to say that you could fly in several national hang gliding competitions and never have to worry about passing that test.


EDIT:
I once asked my dad about an apprentice welding study question, “What is the potential arc voltage of a welding machine idling and at rest?”
In his career as a weldor and having been the boss over about one hundred weldors in a weld shop he told me, “You could go through a 40 year welding career and never have to know the answer to that question.” (as I later found out the answer was something like 18 to 24 volts. But I’m retired now and am not sure of that answer. --and also never needed to know.)

For an inventor person like yourself it probably has some importance.

But short of me weighing a dry 32 foot wing spanned glider, dousing the sail in gasoline, touching off the sail with a match, weighing the frame, and subtracting the difference minus grommets, and Mylar I would only be able to venture a guess.

I haven’t been called the sharpest crayon in the box lately or even previously for that matter.

[SamKellner]

I`m now ready to build a full size hangglider.Tom Sines

Hi Tom,

Welcome. You might try one of the HG manufacturers for the weight of sail.

After building EVette, a hang glider should be a piece of cake.

[tomsines27]

Hi Bill, Thanks again for your help. It looks like the fabric makes up almost all of the hangglider weight. Would you say, that's true? By the way we have something in common. My grandfather, was a machinist and welder for the Southern Pacific Railroad. My father was a track welder and my brother could make a mig sing. Me, not so much, but I keep trying. Also, I have three inventors rules.
Rule # 1 start
Rule # 2 don't stop
Rule # 3 refer to rule # 2
More questions to come.
Tom